VoIP 911 Delays

[WorkSafe]

Not sure if anyone is knowledgeable in this area, but I'll give it a shot.

Many of our facilities are swapping over to VoIP phone system. Last week we had an emergency which required a worker to call 911. It looks like there is at least a 8 second delay from the time the work dials 911 and connects to a dispatcher.

Question:

Do any of you know if there is a FCC rule on the connecting time to a 911 dispatcher via a VoIP system?

This issue is in the hands of our communications department, but I was just curious.

Employees are using this apparent "delay" problem to try and get cell signal repeaters/boosters in the facility.

 

[hillbilly1]

There could be a couple of issues, since it's going out over the internet, the local 911 center may have a harder time finding the location info, if transmitted, or their equipment is not compatible with VoIP originated calls. I've had issues with energy management modems not liking VoIP, Data would sometimes flow, then get scrambled.

 

[egnlsn]

VoIP servers don't know if you're calling across the street, across town, cross-country, or internationally. After each button is pressed, it waits for the next tone. After a period of time in which it hears no tone, it places the call. Hence, the delay.

Pressing the # button after the last digit tells the server that you're done dialing and to place the call.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

I don't think that there are any rules about the connection time when using VOIP as that is not regulated by the FCC. The other issue is lack of support money to the local 911 system when you use VOIP and the lack of a requirement that the VOIP system give the PSAP(Public Safety Answering Point) location information. The money that runs your local 911 center, at least in Illinois, comes from a fee on each wireline phone number and each wireless phone number. When you switch to a VOIP system or in most cases to any alternative phone system, the 911 center loses funds that it needs to operate and upgrade its equipment.
Also 8 seconds is not that long. There are 6 seconds between rings on a standard phone system and I believe that the FCC standard recommends that 95% of calls be answered within 4 rings.

 

[WorkSafe]

Thanks for the replies.

I agree also that a 8 second delay does not seem that bad. There are hidden motives in what our employees are complaining about. The whole issue is the lack of cell coverage in this facility. They think it's quicker for them to dial 911 on their cells then wait for the 8 second VoIP delay.

We are on a federal installation so we have our own 911 dispatch and fire department. When someone calls 911 from a land line, it directs them to our own dispatch, but when someone calls from a cell phone, it connected to the cities dispatch, who must in turn redirect the call to our dispatcher. We are talking about probably 30 seconds. So, in reality, the 8 seconds is still quicker.

egnlsn,

Never even thought of that, that's a good point.

I don't like this VoIP system we have anyhow. The phones themselves are very expensive and require an annual "VoIP" fee from the contractor in the tune of at least $350/yr per phone. We have thousands of phones so the costs are high. I guess good ole Ma Bell is going by the way side....

 

[hillbilly1]

I did some work at an Air Force base years ago, and they had jammers that prevented cell phones from working in certain areas of the base. This was right after 9/11, lots of fun trying to weave a dually truck with a 24' trailer thru the barricades. It was the only entrance they would let us use.

 

[Open Neutral]

I asked elsewhere:


The answer is not as straight forward as it should be so bear with me.

Currently, the FCC defines the 911 service network as a dedicated network that is interconnected with, but separate from the PSTN. Thus, the base case is that the FCC regulates VoIP (and wireless) 911-bound traffic, i.e., access to 911 from call origination to the demarc (i.e., input to ILEC selective router, a.k.a., tandem switch). The demarc not only separates the access-to-911 portion of the network from the dedicated 911 service network, it results in multi-jurisdictional oversight for the end-to-end call.

With respect to the dedicated 911 svc network, The FCC has repeatedly deferred all issues related to cost, svc quality, network engineering, operations etc. to states and localities. But, state and local rules are all over the map regarding basic service quality, delay, outage/interruption of service and its restoration. Moreover, there is the same debate (from the usual suspects) about whether and to what extent such regulation is properly applied to IP based anything. From here it can get increasing complicated depending on the geographic area of interest, the role of the PUCs, and the role of the 911 authorities -- of which there are ~ 6,600.

That said, the FCC is currently contemplating whether and to what extent it should extend its Part 4 (i.e., outage reporting) rules to VoIP, but again it would only be relevant for the access network's portion of the 911 call. All of this may change in the NG911 world, but for now the same messiness present elsewhere pertains here.




Think this was more than you wanted to know!

 

[hurk27]

Try training them to dial 911# from now on, it will loose much of the delay, and as you have pointed out, many VOIP systems can have location enabled for 911 calls, while many cell phone 911 will have no idea where you are at creating even more of a delay.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Try training them to dial 911# from now on, it will loose much of the delay, and as you have pointed out, many VOIP systems can have location enabled for 911 calls, while many cell phone 911 will have no idea where you are at creating even more of a delay.

The FCC rules require that the wireless providers supply Automatic Location Information (ALI) to the PSAP. The rules require that

For handset-based solutions: 50 meters for 67 percent of calls, 150 meters for 95 percent of calls

​

For network-based solutions: 100 meters for 67 percent of calls, 300 meters for 95 percent of calls.​

However the PSAP has to be Phase II compliant and request this information from the wireless carriers.

The problem with the VOIP location information is that it is not automatic. The user has to tell the system where they are. That is not a real issue with fixed uses of VOIP phone systems, but can be a problem for travelers who use VOIP for multiple locations.
​

 

[WorkSafe]

They tried the "911#" method and it did not change the delay period.

May take some time for me to hear about what the solution was, if any.

 

[egnlsn]

They tried the "911#" method and it did not change the delay period.

Odd. On ours, there's a 12 second delay for that very reason.

 

[johnnystrauss77]

There could be any reason for that you know voip system connects through internet may be there was broken link which stopping to connect t to your desired destination. When I got installed voip system than problems occur are inevitable and best thing is like if you are connecting in video chat than the connection never broken at least in my case.

 

[hbiss]

It looks like there is at least a 8 second delay from the time the work dials 911 and connects to a dispatcher.

I assume you checked that out by actually picking up a phone and dialing 911? Do it, tell the dispatcher that this is a test. Anything more than a few seconds is not acceptable and could be deadly. Sounds like you have a hosted system. Anything VoIP is a big mistake but hosted systems are the worst of the worst.

-Hal