Voltage drop Vs Breaker size

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Dennis Alwon

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Chapel Hill, NC
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Retired Electrical Contractor
Right nec doesn't require any voltage drop calculation but if you do decide to. its to deliver a certain voltage at a certain amperage you would not then put it on a bigger breaker.

It depends. If I am running a wire to a sub panel that is a good distance from the source I may upsize the wire. To avoid upsizing the EGC, which cannot be done with nm cable, I may use a larger breaker. I have done this.
 

brian john

Senior Member
Location
Leesburg, VA
Over sizing conductors for VD is good practice, if you up the circuit breaker then the end user could add load and defeat the reason you over sized the conductors.

More commonly engineers and electricians often over look voltage drop and leave the end user with a low voltage condition at full load.
 

RETRAINDAILY

Senior Member
Location
PHX, arizona
It depends. If I am running a wire to a sub panel that is a good distance from the source I may upsize the wire. To avoid upsizing the EGC, which cannot be done with nm cable, I may use a larger breaker. I have done this.
if you have a main breaker or fussed on the other end.
but we are talking 300 amp I don't know what is going on on the other end
and I'm thinking pulling a size up or 2 EGC would be more coast effective then up sizing the breaker. I don't know were she is at on wire sizes 300 amp to 400 amp there are a couple of wire sizes in between. the difference between a #4 and a what a #1 for the EGC.
 

Dennis Alwon

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The Op may not even need an egc if it is run in metallic raceway. My point was not financial. You are correct that there may be a big difference between a 300 amp and a 400 amp breaker. I didn't think it could be that much different considering the scope of the job.
 

RETRAINDAILY

Senior Member
Location
PHX, arizona
The Op may not even need an egc if it is run in metallic raceway. My point was not financial. You are correct that there may be a big difference between a 300 amp and a 400 amp breaker. I didn't think it could be that much different considering the scope of the job.

there probably not much of a difference. between a 300 amp and 400 amp breaker if the gear on the other side does not have a main in it or it will have to be 400 rated so now you have a 400 amp system do you re-dreate @ 400 amp?
 

Hameedulla-Ekhlas

Senior Member
Location
AFG
Thanks all guys for your information. But I have one thing else also in my mind.

1. If we upsize the cable size suppose from 185 SM to 300 SM for a long length to compensate the voltage drop. That is ok I am agree 100% and we must do it.


2. Now if we also increase the breaker size too according to 300 SM cable ampere capacity. Some people thinks that is a good job for future load to connect to this feeder in the future.
In my opinion it is not correct. Because for one thing if we add more load to this feeder in the future nothing will happen to cable and breaker because both of them have this capacity to carry. But again the voltage will drop amount increases which we will not get the desired voltage for the connected equipment

3. When we do not increase the breaker size, it means that we limit the amount of connected load to this breaker and also we keep voltage drop to a constant or desired amount.
 

Hameedulla-Ekhlas

Senior Member
Location
AFG
You mean, to share how I have calculated. If it means please send me you email address I will send you by mail. I dont know how to share a file through this forum.
 

philly

Senior Member
One might also decide that this input breaker is to protect the load and might be sized for this purpose, and be considerably less that required to protect the wire. It could not be sized larger than the requirement to protect the wire.

.

I agree with this. Sometimes the breaker may be also serving as the primary protection of a transformer. If you decide to increase the breaker size to match your increased cable size due to voltage drop, then you might comprimise the primary protection of the transformer.
 

gar

Senior Member
Location
Ann Arbor, Michigan
Occupation
EE
100124-1554 EST

Smart $:

Note that I qualified my comment by theory and logic.

That the code allows wires to a motor to be somewhat unprotected under some conditions does not mean it is the right way to do something. This exception is obviously to tolerate inrush current problems and still allow use of moderately inexpensive breakers, and smaller wire than what should be used for the wire. It is obviously a compromise from the ideal philosophy.

It is entirely possible to build a breaker to tolerate any type of inrush characteristic you desire. I did this as a development project for Mechanical Products in the early 1960s. As an example I could tolerate any desired inrush current for maybe 16 MS, then threshold within 1% of some desire rating after that. And of course today you could use any desired complex algorithm for the trip function.


Hameedulla-Ekhlas:

I agree with your three points.



philly:

That seems like a good example.

However, I generally favor protecting the load at the load.

Now consider an aircraft application. In the 60s this was Mechanical Products biggest market. Here you have many breakers located in an easily accessible location, the cockpit. Of primary importance is protection of the wiring. But because of the nature of an aircraft one might also use the breaker for protection of the load equipment, and thus undersize the breaker relative to the wire size.

.
 
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