Watch those Backstabs

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jmellc

Senior Member
Location
Durham, NC
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Facility Maintenance Tech. Licensed Electrician
Had a service call where microwave kept going out. Sometimes tripped breaker, sometimes not. Kept hearing a click sounding like coming from crawl space, sounded like a breaker tripping. Went under & found no other load on the ckt & no OC device. Checked again & found the recep was 2nd in line. 1st had been back stabbed & wires were very loose. Still gave a good voltage reading, on that recep & the others downline. A blender worked fine on the ckt, smaller load. But the MW was causing wires to vibrate a little & flicker. That put MW into reset mode. I pigtailed the recep & others downline too. No more problem. Look for this if you get a strange acting microwave.
 
goldstar said:
Oh Boy !!! Here we go again with back-stabs. Can't imagine where this thread will go.:?
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As long as I see the havoc wrought by backstabbing, I will continue to post about it. You must not do much service work or you would be on the same band wagon.
 
I bet this topic has been beat to death, but I for one have seen enough burned up back stabbed receptacles on air conditioner and fridge circuits that I do not back stab.

I have also seen some burned up receptacles with the wires under the screws, but fewer of those.
 
jumper said:
Along with ground up or down.

Is SEU safe?

Are MWBCs bad?

Do I need a wire for an EGC?

How many receptacles can I put on a residential receptacle circuit?

Etc....Watching paint dry is more exciting than these threads.
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But if you have a service call for a microwave losing power, you will know what to do.:D
 
jumper said:
Along with ground up or down.

Is SEU safe?

Are MWBCs bad?

Do I need a wire for an EGC?

How many receptacles can I put on a residential receptacle circuit?

Etc....Watching paint dry is more exciting than these threads.
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You forgot, Do I need a junction box every 100'?
 
But a condulet costs more than a 4 square.

It takes soooo much effort to back stab since they shrunk up the holes in the back of them there receptacles. Have to drill em out now to get them wires in. Why do they put all those screws on the side of em for, is that so you can gang em up? Is that there green screw have to be used too or can we just clip it off so it don't get in the way. Last but no least WHY use a 7/8th inch screw in the brace when you have to have less than 1/16 inch of combustible material between the edge of the box and the surface. Means you have about an inch of screw for every switch an receptacle installed, that isn't necesarry. They should have discount devices that let us choose our own sized drywall screw.
 
jumper said:
Silly me, I thought there were a variety of reasons why a microwave circuit may not be working properly.:roll:
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Nope, only backstabbing. Backstabbing is the only reason anything goes wrong anywhere.:lol:
 
yankj said:
This same indication holds for any "bad" connection. I see it all the time where guys don't twist conductors together before using a wirenut.
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I had a helper once who was a great kid, do anything you ask & not complain. But he never could get something right, even a few by luck of the draw. I walked by when he was making up a box, furiously twisting his wires good & tight; to the LEFT. Took a few minutes to explain why that would fall apart.:)
 
My 2 cents on back stabbing receptacles, i've been on just as many service calls where the original installer forgot to tighten the screw as I have for back stabbed receptacles.
 
stickboy1375 said:
My 2 cents on back stabbing receptacles, i've been on just as many service calls where the original installer forgot to tighten the screw as I have for back stabbed receptacles.
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And now it begins !!!

I'm not out to pick on anyone in particular here, just stating my opinion like others have. I've heard this reply more often than I'd like to remember. IMHO, this type of connection is designed for SPEED only. It ranks among the worst possible electrical connections one could make. In all probability the electrician (or helper) that uses back-stabs probably works for a track builder where the price for the job is the same on every house. The faster you finish - the more $$ you make.

Now stop and think about when you buy a switch or a receptacle. The screws on the device are all the way out and are obviously designed to have wire wrapped around them and the screws torked down. Any electrician worth his salt would tork down the screws even if they are not used. If you are the level of electrician that chooses to use the back stab connection on either receptacles or switches consider the fact that those un-torked screws now give you less room (side to side) when either ganged together or installed in a single gang metal JB and make that installation more dangerous than necessary.

Next we have the quality of the stab connection. Duplex receptacles are obviously designed to have "feed-through" connections so, let's say you have 8 or 10 duplex receptacles connected together on a run and you used the back-stabs as your connection method. As appliances are connected down stream of the first receptacle, that first receptacle is taking the heat for the entire circuit. As that circuit starts to heat up the holding fork (for lack of a better term) inside the receptacle heats up and the wire it's holding starts to loosen. When it loosens it starts to arc and, if you're lucky will just pop out of the connection. If you're not so lucky it will burn up the receptacle and possibly start an electrical fire. Can this possibly happen with a screw-down type connection - yes but the probability is a lot less.

Finally, when you think about the quality of a back-stab connection think about why the holes in the backs of duplex receptacles and s/p and 3-way switches have been reduced by the manufacturers to only accept # 14 AWG. Why don't they accept # 12 AWG ? The next time you buy a single receptacle take a look at the back of the receptacle and see if there are any holes or the capability to accept back-stabs. There's a reason. It's a lousy connection method.
 
stickboy1375 said:
i've been on just as many service calls where the original installer forgot to tighten the screw as I have for back stabbed receptacles.
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cowboyjwc said:
I'm with you there.
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I can honestly say that I have not seen this.

I have seen a few loose screws but not many but I have had to replace every receptacle in a room due to loose back stab connections.

Back stabbing is legal and acceptable for a minimum standard but it's not as good as a properly torqued screw ( In my opinion).

I will admit one reason for finding so many bad back stabs may be because that is the way the majority of new homes are wired in this area. I almost never see a new house where there is anything other than back stabbing.
 
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