Who is Liable?

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davedottcom

davedottcom

Senior Member
Need some advice guys...
I rough wired a house, received partial payment for the work... and then the GC was fired!
Now the home owner has taken over the job, he removed my name from the permit and is now altering the (my) wiring. He plans on finishing the electric himself or using his "friend"!?!?

He did not have a problem with my work, just the GC. But, the GC has somehow made it (legally) impossible for the home owner to use me as his electrician.
I honestly don't care either way if he does it himself or if he hires me to complete it. I received payment for the work I already performed.
My question is...
Am I still liable (at all) for the wiring now that I have been removed from the job/permit and the wiring is being altered?
or is ALL of the liability now on the shoulders of the current electrician (home owner)?

:?
Dave
 
I'm not a lawyer.

But it seems to me that if someone else takes over the wiring work, it's all on him. I don't see how you could be liable for wiring that has been altered by someone else. That person could do all sorts of illegal/dangerous stuff, and you have no control over it. How would you be liable for that?

I've had jobs where I took over someone else's work, and I was told by the AHJs that I was taking responsibility for the whole thing when I took out my permit. Naturally, I inspected everything that had already been done and fixed the mistakes.

To be on the safe side, though, I'd talk to your lawyer to get a more informed opinion than mine.
 
Call the AHJ/Building Dept and tell tehm the owner removed you from the job and he is now doing the wiring himself. The inspector should then pull the electrical permit.
Also talk to your attorney.
 
send a letter to the construction office telling them you are no longer the contractor on the job, this should stop anymore inspections until a change of contractor is received
 
The home owner pulled all new permits listing himself as the builder, plumber, & electrician etc...

I will go to the building dept. just to make sure my name is no longer on the permit. Then he can do what ever he wants to do.

I was really just looking for reassurance that I am no longer liable for the wiring now that it's been altered.

I can't imagine I would be...but I figured I'd check with the peanut gallery!
:D
Thanks guys!

Dave
 
Regardless of anything if there is aproblem They could "try" to come after you. This is what courts are for.
What it would boil down to is his attorney against yours.

Do you have insurance? Do you have enough to cover your Net worth x3?
I'd suggest getting a personal Umbrella Insurance policy for you regardless of this one job.
 
make sure you put it in writing and the date you stopped doing work there, that letter will stay in file for that job and keep a copy for yourself
 
Yep, I agree it would be a good idea to give the bldg dept. a formal statement explaining the situation. Couldn't hurt. I'll ask them if there is anything more I should do to protect myself. Although it's never happened to me before, I'm sure it's not the first time they have seen it happen.
I already told the home owner "You definately voided your warranty"!!! :p
 
The building dept. should not issue a second permit for the work untill they have been notified that you have been released by the person that hiered you. Sometimes in a busy office a second permit is issued by the clerck.

Explain your problem to the AHJ. I think he can help you.
 
That is why you should collect 70% on the rough.Dont want me to finish than great :D :D :D :D And i am off the hook soon as he touches the job.Your contract was with the builder,perhaps you could go after him for balance and performance of contract and lein the house.Owner will gladly sign you off to drop the lein.
 
Re: Who is Liable?

davedottcom said:
But, the GC has somehow made it (legally) impossible for the home owner to use me as his electrician.
Click to expand...
How is that possible? If the homeowner sees the error of his ways, and decides to pay you to finish the electrical installation, how is the GC going to prevent it from happening? :? :?:
 
In our jurisdiction, once you have applied for an inspection, you are the electrician of record for that project. Another electrician cannot file for an inspection unless you have asked to be removed as the electrician of record, or it can be proven that you have defaulted on the job. The new electrician then assumes al responsibility and liability for the job.
 
You touch it, you break it, you fix it. Your off the hook. But you don't want your name associated with the GC, that can cause some problems down the road. Stay clear of him and try to collect the money you are owed from either the homeowner or the EX-GC.
 
77401 said:
Regardless of anything if there is aproblem They could "try" to come after you. This is what courts are for.
What it would boil down to is his attorney against yours.

Do you have insurance? Do you have enough to cover your Net worth x3?
I'd suggest getting a personal Umbrella Insurance policy for you regardless of this one job.
Click to expand...

personal umbrellas do not typically cover work done for hire.

he needs professional liability insurance. presumably he already has this if he is a legit EC.
 
davedottcom said:
The home owner pulled all new permits listing himself as the builder, plumber, & electrician etc...

I will go to the building dept. just to make sure my name is no longer on the permit. Then he can do what ever he wants to do.

I was really just looking for reassurance that I am no longer liable for the wiring now that it's been altered.

I can't imagine I would be...but I figured I'd check with the peanut gallery!
:D
Thanks guys!

Dave
Click to expand...

I would not be all that worried about such a situation. I'd be inclined to send a letter to the building department advising them you are not involved in the project anymore and outlining the scope of work you actually performed so there is a permanent record of the work you finished. You might want to ask that they inspect the work you did, but I don't know if the inspection folks would agree to inspect just part of a job. they only really care about the job as a whole.

You really cannot do much more, and if something bad happens, thats why you have insurance.
 
memyselfandI said:
You touch it, you break it, you fix it. Your off the hook.
Click to expand...

That is absolutely untrue. If you believe that, you are seriously deluding yourself. The reason one buys liability insurance is because you WILL be sued if something goes wrong on a job you touched. Even supply houses get sued from time to time when thy supplied materials to a job that goes bad.

I worked for a company that got sued once because an end user modified a piece of equipment we supplied so that it was unsafe and someone got hurt. The company I worked for did not even know about the modification. Several companies that supplied materials associated with both the modification and the original project were also sued.

I think the company's insurance carrier settled rather than spend the money to fight it out. It was a long time ago, but I seem to recall the reason they settled was because the plaintiff was claiming our service guy knew about the modification, and there was a document written by someone at the plant that could be taken in a way to suggest our service guy may (or may not) have known about the modification. I think the service guy had passed away so there was no practical way to fight such an allegation in the minds of the insurance carrier, so they settled.
 
IMO once the homeowner listed himself as the electrical installer your liability ended.Who`s to say he didn`t remove 100 % of your wiring and install 100 % of his own.You could have did the initial install but when he took over he took the jobs liability is on his shoulders and not yours.
 
Charlie, I really don't know if it is true or not but the Home Owner says the GC had a clause in the contract saying he can't use his subs if such a situation accured. The GC agrees this is true but says he will "release" me to work for the homeowner if I want him to.
Honestly, I just want to walk away from both of them. They are both very dishonest and I don't trust them any more. I prefer to just get out before I'm in any deeper.
The home owner has no intention of hiring me under a new contract anyway because he thinks he can finish everything himself.
Yes, financially, I took a hit... my first one since I've been in business for myself. I did receive enough payment to at least cover the materials.

My ONLY concern now is removing my liability since the wiring has now been altered and who knows what he's doing!

I am meeting with the Bldg. Dept. tomorrow to notify them, document that I am no longer the electrician, and to discuss the whole mess!
:roll:
 
davedottcom said:
Charlie, I really don't know if it is true or not but the Home Owner says the GC had a clause in the contract saying he can't use his subs if such a situation accured.
Click to expand...
That sounds like a reasonable contract clause, intended to prevent the GC from losing their fee (i.e., if the HO tries to hire the sub without paying the GC a fee). But I doubt it would continue to apply if the GC lost the contract and if you are no longer working under that GC.

I think you are going about this correctly. But let me suggest that you keep your discussions with the Building Department focused on the issue of eliminating your own liability. Don't let them think you are just trying to get the HO or GC in trouble as a punishment for not paying you all that they owe you.
 
Charlie, Trust me, at this point I just want to clear my name from the job. I know the building dept. doesn't care if I'm making any money or not! :D :cry:
I just want to make sure they know what's going on.

I've already chalked it off as a loss. Not a problem...I have plenty of other jobs that are running just fine to concentrate on.

Thanks guys
:wink:

Dave
 
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