Why Would They Do This

[iwire]

I really don't believe there are that many companies out there that try to pull a bait and switch or try to sell more work while there.

I think you will find many business doing exactly that, and making money doing it.

 

[dezwitinc]

Cowboy,
Wouldn't it be fun to call one of these guys, get him out to the house, and act like you don't have a clue about anything?
Meanwhile, you have switched a couple of wires on a three way or removed the neutral from a GFI breaker.
Let them walk around, check out the situation, and give you their line of BS.
Ask them to sit down in your office and let them see your credentials hanging there on the wall.
All in a good day's fun.

Aline,
Did you happen to see the 60 Minutes piece a year or so ago when they tracked a couple of the companies associated with the conglomerate electrical outfits?
Telling people they needed a new 100 amp main, removing the old one, going to the truck, shining it up with Windex, and then charging $600 for the replacement. Total elapsed time - 40 minutes.
I know of at least two contractors in my area who pay their service techs a very hefty bonus for everything they upsell.
There is a base price for certain items and anything you sell it for above that is money in your pocket.
Personally, I think it goes on alot more than you believe, especially here in South Florida - Home of the Scam Artist and the elderly population center of the US.

 

[aline]

Cowboy,
Aline,
Did you happen to see the 60 Minutes piece a year or so ago when they tracked a couple of the companies associated with the conglomerate electrical outfits?
Telling people they needed a new 100 amp main, removing the old one, going to the truck, shining it up with Windex, and then charging $600 for the replacement. Total elapsed time - 40 minutes.
I know of at least two contractors in my area who pay their service techs a very hefty bonus for everything they upsell.
There is a base price for certain items and anything you sell it for above that is money in your pocket.
Personally, I think it goes on alot more than you believe, especially here in South Florida - Home of the Scam Artist and the elderly population center of the US.

I personally believe in upselling. Upselling does not mean selling the customer something they don't need or something they won't benefit from.

The kind of thing your talking about may happen more than I think. But I don't think upselling is a bad thing. Sometimes customer's are happy when I suggest things they didn't know existed. Like being able to control their lights with a remote from their car. If I'm an electrician and I sell something like this why shouldn't I get some kind of bonus or commision? If I don't, why would I even bother trying to sell it?

In my opinion, if I go on a service call and I notice they have no smoke or carbon monoxide alarms, there is nothing wrong with suggesting they have them installed and offering them a discount if they have me install them while I'm there. Or perhaps I think they would like a dimmer installed for their dining room light. Nothing wrong with suggesting it and offering a discount to install it while I'm there.

This is the kind of upselling I do. There's plenty of this kind of stuff you can offer and suggest so you don't have to look for ways rip off a customer to increase the amount of the service call. I also don't see anything wrong with giving the electrician that takes the time to suggest, offer and sell these things a commision or bonus. He wouldn't necessarily need to get a commision or bonus on things related to repairs just on other things he feels the customer may want. Kind of like a car salesman who sells those nice chrome wheels with the car instead of the plain stock ones.

If it's an older home and they've added a disposal I'll always check under the sink. It's often a unsafe wiring nightmare from a do it yourselfer under there. Another great upsell that benefits the customer and may save someones life. I often upsell GFCI receptacles as well.

Nothing wrong with upselling as long as it's something the customer needs or will benefit from. I've also talked customers out of buying things from me that I didn't feel they would benefit from. Like the guy who insisted he needed a 400 amp service upgrade for his 1500 sq ft. home with all gas appliances because he was going to finish the basement. I did a load calc and found his existing 125 amp service was enough. I couldn't convince him of this though because his brother in law was an engineer and told him he needed at least a 400 amp service and didn't know how it ever passed inspection in the first place. I ended up talking him into going with a 200 amp service upgrade with a new 200amp 42 circuit panel.

 

[480sparky]

She asked me if I would mind if she called someone out of the phone book to check my price. I said sure. I don't mind. I expected her to get an hourly rate of $85 per hour or some type of price comparable to mine(

If someone says they can find someone to do it for less, I always respond that I can find someone who will do it for more.

 

[4x4]

This thread has brought up a lot of thoughts. lol

There is several places around here that do the I'm not gonna call it upselling. I will call it "False Need Selling" or a "Lie" they tell them they need alot more than they really do.

Do yall ever get the calls that say I just need a light it won't take 15 min to do, you get there and it no where easy to get to power, or they won't the light out in the shed and you have to run power to it. lol Then they complain cause they think the bill is to high.

 

[danickstr]

for one thing, she absolutely cannot compare your bid and their bid. you DID diagnose the problem, her diagnosis was a falling light. She was too uninformed to know the difference between a baffle trim and a light fixture, until you told her about that.

secondly, I do believe that the guys with slick trucks are there to upsell. it is fact for the plumbing trucks that they are supposed to make any call into a 400 dollar event in the big city. don't see why electrical trucks would be any different, especially when your client can't tell a trim from a fixture. ripe for the picking by an unscrupulous truck man.

 

[aline]

I do believe that the guys with slick trucks are there to upsell. it is fact for the plumbing trucks that they are supposed to make any call into a 400 dollar event in the big city. don't see why electrical trucks would be any different, especially when your client can't tell a trim from a fixture. ripe for the picking by an unscrupulous truck man.

I'm definately there to upsell if I can. I'm sure not there to try to see how little money I can get.

Just about everywhere you go people are trying to upsell you. Why do you think they ask you if you would like to supersize your value meal? Do you think they're afraid you might starve to death? Why do you think they ask you if you would like desert after your dinner when your at a restaurant? They're not selling something you need. They're selling something that you probably shouldn't eat and is actually bad for you.

I see nothing wrong with turning a $135 service call into a $400 dollar event if it's done honestly. I've had $135 service calls that I turned into over a $1,000 just by suggesting some things, letting them know about some of the things available like the Lutron Radio RA systems, etc. Some people actually do like to be upsold and buy things. Just look around at the homes and cars people buy these days. Clearly they don't need these expensive homes and cars but they want them.

There's upselling and there's cheating and ripping off the customer. These are two completely different things.

I would also rather show up in slick truck than a beat up old rust bucket that leaks oil all over their driveway.

I didn't know that the perception was that if you have a nice clean slick truck you must be a crook.

Maybe I should buy an old beat up pile of crap that breaks down often so everyone will know I must be one of the few honest contractors.

I can't believe how much contractors hate and distrust each other. We wonder why the general public has little respect for contractors when we openly bash each other in public forums like this talking about how most of us are crooks trying to rip people off. I'll never trust anyone who shows up at my home in a slick truck again.

I think contractors charging too much and taking advantage of people are the least of our problems. I think our biggest problem is too many contractors charging too little and letting people take advantage of us.

 

[macmikeman]

I didn't have time to read all the way through this thread, but from what I can tell, the problem was really that you should have taken MDshunks truck out to that job instead. He has three of everything made. :grin:

 

[4x4]

I can't believe how much contractors hate and distrust each other. We wonder why the general public has little respect for contractors when we openly bash each other in public forums like this talking about how most of us are crooks trying to rip people off.

Sometimes the truth is not pretty.

 

[bjp_ne_elec]

Aline - I agree with Celtic - but I think maybe by your visit you made the customer a little smarter as to what was wrong. Did she use some of the info you gave her, to help resolve what really needed to be done?

This guy still sounds way too low, but what he did by knowing what he needed to pick up, was to save a good percentage of the round trip travel time to pick up the part.

First of all, I wouldn't even of drove out there, unless I at least made the customer aware of a minimum service call.

Think ya got a few "lessons learned" on this one.

Note: It looks like I didn't see the additional page of posts - but again, we should learn something from this post. It's obviously a personal business decision what each of us do with it.

 

[growler]

He asked her for the part number from the trim and after a little while he then tells her it would be $75 and that includes both parts and labor.(

I had another contractor that low balled my price like that. I told the homeowner to write out the check for that amount and to not give them one penny more. I made a copy of their estimate and told the homeowner that if they tried to add to the price that I would go with her to court. It was a great price but the materials were going to cost more than what was quoted.

 

[celtic]

...and then ?????

 

[growler]

...and then ?????

It's just a way to keep homeowners from being taken-in by the bait and switch guys. If they say they can do a service call for $75 then hand them a check for $75 and let them know they are not getting any more.

 

[tallguy]

No. I have a dispatch fee to go out and look at the job. Then I give them an upfront price in writing for the costs of the repairs. Currently my dispatch fee is $29. I know others in my area, that operate this way, are charging any where from $29 to $49 for a dispatch fee. If the customer doesn't accept the price for the repairs all they pay is the dispatch fee. The dispatch fee doesn't include diagnosing wiring problems but there wasn't any diagnosis involved in this case so I only collected the $29.

Many of the plumbers in my area use that same business model, but they charge closer to $80-$100 for the dispatch fee... I hate it and won't use them. Once they are there, they have you over the barrel and give you a "fixed price" which is heavily laden with margin to cover the overhead of the giant graphics on their giant truck.

I go with a local T&M guy I've been using for nearly 15 years. It's going to take the time that it takes, and I trust him not to screw me. There's nothing like a well earned long term reputation.

 

[macmikeman]

Once they are there, they have you over the barrel and give you a "fixed price" which is heavily laden with margin to cover the overhead of the giant graphics on their giant truck.

The nerve of them, attempting to build the cost of advertizing back into their product. They should be reported to the authorities, or burned at the stake for attempting to copy the "real" businesses like Sears or Wallmart.

 

[aline]

Many of the plumbers in my area use that same business model, but they charge closer to $80-$100 for the dispatch fee... I hate it and won't use them. Once they are there, they have you over the barrel and give you a "fixed price" which is heavily laden with margin to cover the overhead of the giant graphics on their giant truck.

I agree.

I wish Burger King would charge me T&M for my hamburger so I wouldn't have to pay for all that expensive TV advertising.

Oh, wait a minute, wouldn't they have to build this into their hourly rate?

Why do you have to have expensive advertising, giant graphics and a giant truck to give a fixed price upfront?

Seems to me whether you charge T&M or give a fixed price you still have to cover all of your expenses whatever they might be.

 

[tallguy]

The nerve of them, attempting to build the cost of advertizing back into their product. They should be reported to the authorities, or burned at the stake for attempting to copy the "real" businesses like Sears or Wallmart.

Not sure if that was a poke at me or not, but for the record I say "go for it" to those who can turn a profit in that fashion... There's nothing untoward about it at all. It's the land of the free (capitalism) and home the brave (consumer). I'll just avoid those companies myself, is all.

I agree.

I wish Burger King would charge me T&M for my hamburger so I wouldn't have to pay for all that expensive TV advertising.

Oh, wait a minute, wouldn't they have to build this into their hourly rate?

Why do you have to have expensive advertising, giant graphics and a giant truck to give a fixed price upfront?

Seems to me whether you charge T&M or give a fixed price you still have to cover all of your expenses whatever they might be.

Of course... It's just that it seems like high marketing costs and fixed price strategies seem to go hand in hand around these parts. If that's what the consumer wants, then fine. I and my money will go the more traditional route of T&M. Others don't like embarking on a repair with that unknown hanging over their head. Nothing inherently better or worse about either one.

I like my burgers fixed price, FWIW...

However, if I had to pay $1.99 to enter the store, and then I'd get to hear the Whopper's fixed price, I might opt for T&M after all!

 

[Trovmar]

Move on. We alll price differently and for different reasons. I recently went on a call to find out why a womans track lights weren't working. Within 5 minutes i found it was a bad dimmer. She had a new one and i put it in....cost...no charge. She offered me money for gas and time but I told her to just give out my name. I recieved 5 more calls from that job. I made back what seemed to be a free be.On the other hand I charged $95 for a small job I knew would last about 1/2 hour. I ended up running out to the Home Depot 3 times because there were unseen problems. The job took 2 hours. I stuck to my quote and only charged $95.

 

[aline]

I like my burgers fixed price, FWIW...

However, if I had to pay $1.99 to enter the store, and then I'd get to hear the Whopper's fixed price, I might opt for T&M after all!

I don't charge them a dime if they bring their house to my shop.

 

[aline]

I recieved 5 more calls from that job. I made back what seemed to be a free be.

Did they want their dimmers installed for free too?

How do you know you wouldn't have recieved 5 more calls from that job if you had charged her?