Wire depth

[luke warmwater]

Re: Wire depth

IMO, a residential branch circut would be one that originates in a residence. Therefore use column one. The zoning isn't the issue, it's where it is fed from imo.

 

[johnpm]

Re: Wire depth

I understand what you are saying.If the origin is
the deciding factor,(and not location) this column would be labled "dwelling unit branch circuit." That is the question,location vs. origin.

 

[david]

Re: Wire depth

This is not a dwelling circuit, and dwelling is not the issue. Any lot that a dwelling sets on is a residential area. Look at other section in the code that mentions residential areas. When deciding the min height of a service drop attachment or the lowest point in the sag of an overhead service drop. You would classify an area out side of a building as to what the building is being used for.

 

[gent]

Re: Wire depth

How about a concrete cover?

 

[johnpm]

Re: Wire depth

Concrete was discussed, but the homeowners didn't
like the idea of a "concrete path" going through the edge of the lawn.

 

[cm]

Re: Wire depth

How about cement brick layed over the circuit call it precast concrete and ask the inspector to pass it under 90.4

[ March 09, 2003, 07:19 PM: Message edited by: cm ]

 

[johnpm]

Re: Wire depth

That's an idea I will suggest. I talked with NEC
public affairs today. They think this should be
classified as a residential branch circuit. I have
NEC on one side and AHJ on the other.NEC says I
should take this to arbitration. So I guess that
is the next step. Thanks for all of the great ideas and opinions.

JohnM.

 

[iwire]

Re: Wire depth

Did the AHJ you speak of give you any idea what he would have accepted? Would it be a big deal to do it?

Will it be worth it if you go to arbitration even if you prevail?

Arbitration rarely ends in a victory for either party, it is about compromise.

By my count 8 members (9 if I count myself) feel this is commercial and no one except yourself has thought of it as residential.

I am not trying to give you a hard time, I just doubt arbitration will get you what you want.

 

[johnpm]

Re: Wire depth

By my count 8 members (9 if I count myself) feel this is commercial and no one except yourself has thought of it as residential.

Maybe you didn't read my first and last post. I
called NEC last week and today. On both occasions,
they agreed with me. I wanted to bring this to the
forum to discuss different viewpoints.You are right,9 members have shown different viewpoints.
It would cost alot to modify this project. But,the
costs are not that important. The question is "Who
is right,the AHJ or the NEC?" That is the dilema,
and the reason for the "second opinions"

 

[david]

Re: Wire depth

Check your building code for a definition of residential

The PA. UCC defines residential building as construction relating to detached one-family and two-family dwellings and multiple single-family dwellings (townhouses) that are not more than 3 stories in height with separate egress and their own accessory structures.

 

[iwire]

Re: Wire depth

Originally posted by johnpm:
Maybe you didn't read my first and last post. I
called NEC last week and today. On both occasions,
they agreed with me.

I did read all the posts I was referring to members of this forum.

I wanted to bring this to the
forum to discuss different viewpoints.

And that is just what we all have done.

It would cost alot to modify this project. But,the
costs are not that important. The question is "Who
is right,the AHJ or the NEC?"

In my state the answer to that is clearly the "Authority Having Jurisdiction" (not the local inspector) the name says it all.

But isn't a safe installation more important then a battle of wills?

I do not think it takes much imagination to see someone stuffing a shovel into this wire that is resting on solid rock.

Your first post starts with

I would like your opinion on this.

In my opinion you should use Note 5 of table 300.5

[ March 11, 2003, 04:52 PM: Message edited by: iwire ]

 

[luke warmwater]

Re: Wire depth

I'm sticking to my original post also. Use column one. But would like to add, that I agree with Bob, since you can't reach that depth, refer to Note 5.

 

[w6259]

Re: Wire depth

I think this is simple...this is not a dwelling therefore it must be other than dwelling.

Also, the concrete does not have to go across the yard, pour the concrete directly above the conduit and cover it up. That's even specified at our site. We even identify it as electrical by adding red dye to the concrete as an alert for buried electrical. Hope this helps.

 

[iwire]

Re: Wire depth

Originally posted by w6259:
We even identify it as electrical by adding red dye to the concrete as an alert for buried electrical.

I just ran into the red dye requirement in a job spec for a duct bank, sounds like a good idea but I am wondering if someone is told to break it up whether they will know that red dye means "electric"

 

[gent]

Re: Wire depth

w6259
Covered concrete is what I would suggest here. Where this has been done here... the conduit/conductors are installed with 2" concrete cover minimum. Warning tape is placed in the ditch as it is backfilled. That should make the inspector happy and still give them about 8" of topsoil to grow a lawn.