Wiring a 3- way
- Thread starter friday
- Start date
- Status
- Location
- Massachusetts
Re: Wiring a 3- way
Sure, but not without using a relay.
410.54(B) prevent switching just one of the ungrounded conductors.
Sure, but not without using a relay.
410.54(B) prevent switching just one of the ungrounded conductors.
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician
Re: Wiring a 3- way
Bob,
Would two 3-way switches fit the description of the switching device of auxillary equipment as it relates to 410.54? Wouldn't auxiliary equipment be more like a integral photocell?
Bob,
Would two 3-way switches fit the description of the switching device of auxillary equipment as it relates to 410.54? Wouldn't auxiliary equipment be more like a integral photocell?
- Location
- Massachusetts
Re: Wiring a 3- way
If you look at 410.54(A) it seems to bare that out.
IMO the auxiliary equipment in 410.54(B) is the ballast.
If you look at 410.54(A) it seems to bare that out.
lady sparks lover
Senior Member
Re: Wiring a 3- way
I thought the terminal have to be withing 10% of the rating. I would say 277 would be to high, correct? At single pole 240/120V, would it not be rated at 120V?
I thought the terminal have to be withing 10% of the rating. I would say 277 would be to high, correct? At single pole 240/120V, would it not be rated at 120V?
kentirwin
Senior Member
- Location
- Norfolk, VA
Re: Wiring a 3- way
Hmmm... Perhaps the "neutral" is not a neutral - just a white wire? Sounds like the two switches are in series if both must be on to light things up. It's difficult to diagnose from afar with little information. :roll:
Hmmm... Perhaps the "neutral" is not a neutral - just a white wire? Sounds like the two switches are in series if both must be on to light things up. It's difficult to diagnose from afar with little information. :roll:
- Location
- Illinois
- Occupation
- retired electrician
Re: Wiring a 3- way
Lady,
Is this is an older building? They often used a 3-way set up that had both the hot and the neutral going to the terminals where the travelers should be connected to and each of the common terminals hooked to the fixture.
Don
Lady,
Is this is an older building? They often used a 3-way set up that had both the hot and the neutral going to the terminals where the travelers should be connected to and each of the common terminals hooked to the fixture.
Don
physis
Senior Member
Re: Wiring a 3- way
Edit: The wiring might have gotten rearranged in the switch boxes.
Edit again: If there are still two three way switches I think there's a problem with one of the travellers . Either that or the switches have been replaced with Levitons and they don't work right? That's gotta make Leviton proud.
[ June 28, 2005, 02:49 PM: Message edited by: physis ]
Sounds like it was done wrong to me. But I've seen a lot of switched neutrals in old houses though, that part of it doesn't sound too unusual.
Edit: The wiring might have gotten rearranged in the switch boxes.
Edit again: If there are still two three way switches I think there's a problem with one of the travellers . Either that or the switches have been replaced with Levitons and they don't work right? That's gotta make Leviton proud.
[ June 28, 2005, 02:49 PM: Message edited by: physis ]
southernboys
Senior Member
Re: Wiring a 3- way
sounds like a dead end 3way to me. what type of wires do you have in each box. ie does one box have 2 12/2s and 1 12/3 in it the other box should have one 12/3
sounds like a dead end 3way to me. what type of wires do you have in each box. ie does one box have 2 12/2s and 1 12/3 in it the other box should have one 12/3
hardworkingstiff
Senior Member
- Location
- Wilmington, NC
Re: Wiring a 3- way
It is not uncommon to send the "hot" potential on the white wire and the power back (travelers) on the black and red.
Send more info, we'll get this fixed.
Since 3-way switches don't have on/off written on the switch, I assume you are saying they both have to be up. What happens if they are both down? Did it ever work properly? If so, when did it stop working properly, and did anyone do any work just prior to it stopping?
It is not uncommon to send the "hot" potential on the white wire and the power back (travelers) on the black and red.
Send more info, we'll get this fixed.
jimwalker
Senior Member
- Location
- TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: Wiring a 3- way
You might be dealing with something that really upsets me,and that is the use of a white wire as an ungrounded wire without being remarked.I see this often and want to kill.Only take a few seconds with a marker to fix it but they wont.
What is age of building ? might be a chicago 3 way.
You might be dealing with something that really upsets me,and that is the use of a white wire as an ungrounded wire without being remarked.I see this often and want to kill.Only take a few seconds with a marker to fix it but they wont.
What is age of building ? might be a chicago 3 way.
southernboys
Senior Member
Re: Wiring a 3- way
Jim a marker? What ever happened to black tape. I agree that the wire should be phased. It is plain sorriness not to phase the wire. What is a chicago 3way? Can anyone sugest a web site to see all of the most common 3 ways in a diagram format?
Jim a marker? What ever happened to black tape. I agree that the wire should be phased. It is plain sorriness not to phase the wire. What is a chicago 3way? Can anyone sugest a web site to see all of the most common 3 ways in a diagram format?
jimwalker
Senior Member
- Location
- TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: Wiring a 3- way
Actually an inspector could flunk you for using tape.PERMANENTLY re mark it.He could pull the tape off.A marker usually is in my shirt pocket so is a fast cheap cure.
The chicago 3 way is an old old trick.Perhaps some one can link us to the threads on it.
Actually an inspector could flunk you for using tape.PERMANENTLY re mark it.He could pull the tape off.A marker usually is in my shirt pocket so is a fast cheap cure.
The chicago 3 way is an old old trick.Perhaps some one can link us to the threads on it.
Re: Wiring a 3- way
Forget the DIYer angle, is there an electrician reading this thread that wouldn't know a white conductor connected to a switch is dangerous?
I don't see why this gets you so upset Jim. IMO the re-identifying a white conductor for a switch feed or traveler was an unnecessary code addition.
Roger
[ June 28, 2005, 08:49 PM: Message edited by: roger ]
Forget the DIYer angle, is there an electrician reading this thread that wouldn't know a white conductor connected to a switch is dangerous?
I don't see why this gets you so upset Jim. IMO the re-identifying a white conductor for a switch feed or traveler was an unnecessary code addition.
Roger
[ June 28, 2005, 08:49 PM: Message edited by: roger ]
Re: Wiring a 3- way
WE call this a 3-wire return. Go to the first box and see if the hot or switchleg is wirenuted to the White in the second. Per Code this can only be done to "feed" the switch but it must be re-identified. 3-way switches themselves only need 3 wires to work.
WE call this a 3-wire return. Go to the first box and see if the hot or switchleg is wirenuted to the White in the second. Per Code this can only be done to "feed" the switch but it must be re-identified. 3-way switches themselves only need 3 wires to work.
jimwalker
Senior Member
- Location
- TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: Wiring a 3- way
Roger,it is a guy using half the code to get what he wants.You want to use it then please remark it.It is not that hard.Give the next man a break.I dealt with this today.The guy that roughed it in did nothing.3 wires and black and red were not even twisted.To me thats sloppy work.But then i ran into about a dozen that did not have a ground pigtail either.Thank got i go on vacation thursday night.I was getting the urge all day to kill some one.
Roger,it is a guy using half the code to get what he wants.You want to use it then please remark it.It is not that hard.Give the next man a break.I dealt with this today.The guy that roughed it in did nothing.3 wires and black and red were not even twisted.To me thats sloppy work.But then i ran into about a dozen that did not have a ground pigtail either.Thank got i go on vacation thursday night.I was getting the urge all day to kill some one.
southernboys
Senior Member
Re: Wiring a 3- way
I see where you are coming from jim. thats a solid idea. Roger yes its obvious to a electrician that thats not a neutral. However you take a helper he sees white wire what has he always been taught twist color to color. Herecomes trim man now hes got to ohm wires out to find which is the return. Just phase the damn wire. Is the chicago what I desribed in my earlier post as a deadend?
I see where you are coming from jim. thats a solid idea. Roger yes its obvious to a electrician that thats not a neutral. However you take a helper he sees white wire what has he always been taught twist color to color. Herecomes trim man now hes got to ohm wires out to find which is the return. Just phase the damn wire. Is the chicago what I desribed in my earlier post as a deadend?
Re: Wiring a 3- way
Maybe I am a day late but I am still stuck on both switches have to be on??? How do they know one is on and the other is off? :roll: Technically wouldn't one of the three ways always be on since switching the other causes the circut to close. If both switches have to be in the up position well that happens a lot with three ways since they have no on or off.
Maybe I am a day late but I am still stuck on both switches have to be on??? How do they know one is on and the other is off? :roll: Technically wouldn't one of the three ways always be on since switching the other causes the circut to close. If both switches have to be in the up position well that happens a lot with three ways since they have no on or off.
hurk27
Senior Member
- Location
- Portage, Indiana NEC: 2008
Re: Wiring a 3- way
Check for a common that is swapped with a traveler.
Check for a common that is swapped with a traveler.
Re: Wiring a 3- way
Burch.....
A three way switch can act just as a single pole switch. When the switch is in the up position and installed with the (2) terminals to the right as a single pole switch you will know if the light should be on. Simply install the switch with with "black" wires at the top right, red wires at the top left and the "power" or "switch" leg on the bronze screw at bottom right.
Doing this, both switches will have to be up or down for the light to be on, opposite one switch up and the other down and it is off. simple engineering and will save alot of time with troubleshooting if it does not work if it is done this way at trim out.
Burch.....
A three way switch can act just as a single pole switch. When the switch is in the up position and installed with the (2) terminals to the right as a single pole switch you will know if the light should be on. Simply install the switch with with "black" wires at the top right, red wires at the top left and the "power" or "switch" leg on the bronze screw at bottom right.
Doing this, both switches will have to be up or down for the light to be on, opposite one switch up and the other down and it is off. simple engineering and will save alot of time with troubleshooting if it does not work if it is done this way at trim out.
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