Wiring recptcl & switch technique -- legal?

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M. D. said:
" the original installer stripped a portion of the incoming ungrounded conductor about half-way along its length in the box, probably about 3 inches now exposed in the segment."
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Yes he does say that but then he says that the 3" portion is wrapped around the screw. I agree 3 " is way too much and a sloopy install but at what point is it a violation.

What about the main lugs in a panel. How far out of the lug is too far?
 
Dennis Alwon said:
Yes he does say that but then he says that the 3" portion is wrapped around the screw....
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Not quite he then said

"This portion" (which portion ?? the stripped portion) "was then looped around the screw terminal, and then the very same wire" ( which wire ? the stripped wire) "continues to feed the other switch/receptacle in the box."

That is why he stripped so much ,.. so he could continue to the next device ."The very same" (stripped bare) "wire continues...."
 
I sometimes do switches this way. Depends on what sort of mood I'm in, and if I remember. I pretty much always do the EGC in strip lights this way. Run one ground from end to end, and skin it midspan to go around each ground screw in each fixture.
 
mdshunk said:
I sometimes do switches this way. Depends on what sort of mood I'm in, and if I remember. I pretty much always do the EGC in strip lights this way. Run one ground from end to end, and skin it midspan to go around each ground screw in each fixture.
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Somehow the subject got changed.

You seem to be talking about a totally different ballgame.

The OP was discussing the ungrounded conductor, not the EGC.
 
mdshunk said:
I sometimes do switches this way. Depends on what sort of mood I'm in, and if I remember. I pretty much always do the EGC in strip lights this way. Run one ground from end to end, and skin it midspan to go around each ground screw in each fixture.
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Marc , this guy strips the black wire ,the current carrying conductor,whatever the color, clean off for 3" , hits one device and then he jumps to the next device with the remaining bare current carrying conductor.
 
M. D. said:
Marc , this guy strips the black wire ,the current carrying conductor,whatever the color, clean off for 3" , hits one device and then he jumps to the next device with the remaining bare current carrying conductor.
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M.D.-- I really don't think the op was saying the wire was bare going to the next device. Maybe I am wrong but that is not the impression I am left with.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
M.D.-- I really don't think the op was saying the wire was bare going to the next device. Maybe I am wrong but that is not the impression I am left with.
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Well, it wouldn't be the first time I' ve misunderstood what I've read:smile: :confused:

Hello , lordofpi , are you out there? ,...need a little clarification , Please :)

P.S. it would still qualify as a 110.3 (B) violation ,..Find me instructions for a switch or receptacle outlet the instructs 3" of insulation to be removed for termination.
 
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M. D. said:
Marc , this guy strips the black wire ,the current carrying conductor,whatever the color, clean off for 3" , hits one device and then he jumps to the next device with the remaining bare current carrying conductor.
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Bare? I don't think he was saying that at all, was he? I see switches done this way quite a bit, and they normally only strip maybe little 3/4" sections at each terminal screw. I think he made a type-o when he said 3 inches. If that's really the case, that installer needs a sit down tongue lashing.
 
Yeah , what does

"probably about 3 inches now exposed in the segment" mean?

I took it to mean bare
 
Okay, wow... here I am.... I knew I was a tad vague in my original post, but I did not expect to come home to find that 20 people spent all day disecting one sentence I wrote, lol. Sorry for going to work! Okay, clarifications:

I _did_ exagerate on the length of the exposed segment. 0.75 to 1.00 inches would be more accurate to describe what I saw. The conductor was not bare from there to the next receptacle/switch; something on that level would be a fire-hazard just about any way I could imagine it -- especially in a metal box! Instead, what I witnessed was exactly as you all were discussing in the first couple of pages: a (albeit sloppy in this case) de-insulated/stripped portion of a ungrounded conductor looped around a screw terminal and then the same wire (with remaining insulation) some-what safely traveling unbroken to its stripped terminus around the second receptacle/switch's screw terminal.

I see how most of you all seem to deem this a common-sense practice for an installation, especially in a box with large numbers of devices, but it is certainly more inconvenient for any future electricians that must service it than a series of pigtails might be.
 
M. D. said:
110.3 (B) is what I would cite .
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Again you can not just 'cite 110.3(B)' for anything you feel is unusual.

To cite 110.3(B) the device would have to be installed inconsistently with its instructions that are part of the listing.

You would have to know that a certain amount of striped length is part of the listing.

Read 110.(3)(B) using Charlies rules and you will see what I mean.
 
iwire said:
Again you can not just 'cite 110.3(B)' for anything you feel is unusual.

To cite 110.3(B) the device would have to be installed inconsistently with its instructions that are part of the listing.

You would have to know that a certain amount of striped length is part of the listing.

Read 110.(3)(B) using Charlies rules and you will see what I mean.
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Bob , I have searched for some sort of back up for ignoring the installation instructions provided with equipment or that they are not part of the investigating process for listing, I have found nothing to support that view,... rather quite the opposite and from many different sources .

I have read 110.3(b) about a million times:) . You Know That I love to read and I am willing to change cherished beliefs, I do understand what you mean ,I do not agree.
 
M. D. said:
Bob , I have searched for some sort of back up for ignoring the installation instructions provided with equipment or that they are not part of the investigating process for listing, I have found nothing to support that view,... rather quite the opposite and from many different sources .
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Then you are not reading the section. :grin:

It does not say we have to follow all instructions, only instructions that are included in the listing.

If you don't want to accept what it says in black and white who am I to argue.

In the real world I tend to just assume that all instructions are part of the listing....it keeps it easy and I can not go wrong but that is my own choice not the requirement of 110.3(B).
 
M. D. said:
I have read 110.3(b) about a million times:) . You Know That I love to read and I am willing to change cherished beliefs, I do understand what you mean ,I do not agree.
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I am not sure 110.3(B) is the only article one could site. I would site 110.3(8)-- That's an eight not a "B". I would have to agree with M.D. on this one.
 
iwire said:
Agree about what? :-?

That 110.3(B) requires we follow all instructions?
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No,-- If the wire the op was talking about had been stripped along it's length to the next device then I feel he may have an article to justify turning down the installation.
 
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