3-way Delima

[busman]

When I went to finish today I elected to just pig-tail the 4 neutrals in each recep. since I didn't think it really would matter as to the operation of the 3-way.

Neutrals of this size cannot be in parallel. The extra wire should be left unused OR the tab needs to be removed from both sides of the receptacle.

Mark

 

[quogueelectric]

3way

3way

as far as the 3 way you need 3 parts #1 a feed..........#2 travellers..........#3 a load or switched leg... You did run a 3 wire between 3 way switches and the easiest way is to feed at 1st switch 3 wire travellers to 2nd switch and switched load to devices or lights. Sounds to me like you forgot your travelers between switches.

 

[480sparky]

Jeff: Are you saying you ran 12/4 from the first 3-way to a split recep, then over to the other three-way? Like this?:

3-way-------recep----------recep--------recep-------------3-way

If you did, you won't be able to make the 3-ways work a split recep. You will need a total of 5 conductors, one hot, two travellers, one switch leg and the neutral.

You keep talking about the neutral and extra neutrals and splitting the neutral side. The neutral has nothing to do with 3-way switching and split receps.... it's all done on the hot conductors.

 

[charlie tuna]

not enough information

not enough information

your post does not give a full picture of what you did!! anyway you do it, the neutrals can be separate or common to all the receptacles provided they are spliced together if common???? you need a feed or hot into one three way and two travelers to the other three way, and a switchleg from that three way back to the switched conductor connected to the switched side of the receptacle. you also must have a hot to the unswitched side of the receptacles. easy.................... now what did you do wrong??

 

[Chenley]

This is the only two ways I have to wire them:
Sorry about the background. Would have it on white except it would color the neutrals black and people.

 

[solaeros]

here's how I would do it.

 

[al hildenbrand]

Jeff: Are you saying you ran 12/4 from the first 3-way to a split recep, then over to the other three-way? Like this?:

3-way-------recep----------recep--------recep-------------3-way

Take a look at using the "Traveling Bus 3 way" to make this work.

 

[ElectricianJeff]

Jeff: Are you saying you ran 12/4 from the first 3-way to a split recep, then over to the other three-way? Like this?:

3-way-------recep----------recep--------recep-------------3-way

If you did, you won't be able to make the 3-ways work a split recep. You will need a total of 5 conductors, one hot, two travellers, one switch leg and the neutral.

You keep talking about the neutral and extra neutrals and splitting the neutral side. The neutral has nothing to do with 3-way switching and split receps.... it's all done on the hot conductors.

Sorry....had my monthly poker club last night and wasn't able to stay on top of this thread but I did win some $$$. I am truly amazed by the number of responses.

Heres what I did at rough in:

3way---12/2/2---recep---12/2/2---recep---12/2/2---recep---12/2/2---3way

12/3 3way to 3way

I have the line at one 3 way and the recep load at the other.

Right or wrong, I elected to pig all neutrals (4 total) at each recep making a common neutral for each.

I am headed back there Thurs. so any help making this work is obviouslly greatly appreciated.

Jeff

 

[cadpoint]

Just Bold

Just Bold

Let me back of my earlier statement of Forward or Aft ...

I've never seen that, nor every applied that, that is to Cool.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Jeff-what about conductor fill in that 3 way. Power 12/2 plus 12/3 for 3 way wires plus 12/2/2--- that's 10 conductors without the device or clamps.

I also see issues with parallel neutrals.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

You really don't need the wire from the last recep. to the 3 way switch.

Just dead end one 3 way ( don't use the 12/2/2 from the second 3 way to the recep) and have feed and switched wires come from the first 3 way switch to the first rec. Don't use the second neutral in the 12/2/2 that feeds the recep.

 

[benmin]

Sorry....had my monthly poker club last night and wasn't able to stay on top of this thread but I did win some $$$. I am truly amazed by the number of responses.

Heres what I did at rough in:

3way---12/2/2---recep---12/2/2---recep---12/2/2---recep---12/2/2---3way

12/3 3way to 3way

I have the line at one 3 way and the recep load at the other.

Right or wrong, I elected to pig all neutrals (4 total) at each recep making a common neutral for each.

I am headed back there Thurs. so any help making this work is obviouslly greatly appreciated.

Jeff

Sounds like you might just have a switch miswired. I would check them first.

Feed 3way: 1. All neutrals tied together and stuffed into back of box 2. Red from 12-2-2 capped and stuffed into back of box. 3. Black from 12-2-2 and black from feed tied together and connected to the switch leg screw of the switch (black colored). 4. red and black from the 12-3 used as travellers.

Load 3way: 1. All neutrals tied together and stuffed into back of box. 2. Black from 12-2-2 capped and stuffed into back of box. 3. Red from 12-2-2 connected to switch leg screw on switch (black colored). 4. red and black from the 12-3 used as travellers.

The most common mistake I find is when on the 3way at load side, The Black (always hot) is connected to the 3 way instead of the red (switched)

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Feed 3way: 1. All neutrals tied together and stuffed into back of box 2. Red from 12-2-2 capped and stuffed into back of box. 3. Black from 12-2-2 and black from feed tied together and connected to the switch leg screw of the switch (black colored). 4. red and black from the 12-3 used as travellers.

Load 3way: 1. All neutrals tied together and stuffed into back of box. 2. Black from 12-2-2 capped and stuffed into back of box. 3. Red from 12-2-2 connected to switch leg screw on switch (black colored). 4. red and black from the 12-3 used as travellers.

The most common mistake I find is when on the 3way at load side, The Black (always hot) is connected to the 3 way instead of the red (switched)

This is an illegal hookup with all whites tied together-- art 310.4

 

[benmin]

This is an illegal hookup with all whites tied together-- art 310.4

OK. Then we can disconnect the 12-2-2 red/white in the feed 3way, cap it and place in back of box. That way it will not be "electrically joined at each end"

 

[Dennis Alwon]

OK. Then we can disconnect the 12-2-2 red/white in the feed 3way, cap it and place in back of box. That way it will not be "electrically joined at each end"

You would have to disconnect the red striped white wire everywhere. It still is feeding as a loop from the other direction.

 

[hardworkingstiff]

here's how I would do it.

You would need a 5th conductor between the receptacles to do it that way.

 

[R2006]

Hi Jeff.
Not sure if i understand the question but I'll give it a try.
You have a hot at one 3-way, then you need 3-wire looping the affected outlets, and a 3-wire to the other 3-way, at the 3-way with the hot, splice the nuetral and the white going to the outlets, splice the hot and the black going to the outlets with the black going to the other 3-way, (or what ever color you prefer) the 2 remaining wires to the other 3-way become your travlers,on the 3- way with the hot you should have a red and white to the other 3-way they go under the common screws and the red to the outlets under the diffrent screw, at the outlet break the hot tab(dont break the neutral) and at the other 3-way red and white under common screws and black under diffrent screw. double check me it's been a busy day but i think this should work for you.

 

[al hildenbrand]

3way---12/2/2---recep---12/2/2---recep---12/2/2---recep---12/2/2---3way

12/3 3way to 3way

Jeff,

It'll be simpler with lower wire count to ditch the 12/3.

 

[benmin]

You would have to disconnect the red striped white wire everywhere. It still is feeding as a loop from the other direction.

Even though I believe it is redundant wiring, You're right by my understanding of 310.4

 

[fisherelectric]

Why not just feed it in the receptacle, run a 2-wire switch leg to the first three-way, a 3 wire between switches. Then if you want more 1/2 hot receptacles , come from the first receptacle to the others with a 3 wire.