Abandoned range circuit can i use it for the dryer?

[iwire]

Based on: if the cost difference must come out of my pocket, I don't want it to.

LOL well I certainly respect an honest answer.

That is why I suggested talking to the inspector first. As far as I know the more a job costs the more we should be making assuming it has been priced correctly.

 

[LarryFine]

LOL well I certainly respect an honest answer.

You'll never get any less from me.

 

[steelersman]

I agree with Don, once you change the breaker and the receptacle it is no longer an existing circuit. But ultimately that would be up to the inspector.

do you think that people actually pull permits for a simple receptacle change out? Silly I say!!

 

[steelersman]

Ser has an insulated neutral

 

[steelersman]

And miss the opportunity for a really invigorating argu..., I mean, discussion? Never!


Added: Simply replacing a receptacle and a breaker is something I'd never call in.

Exactly what I've been thinking this whole thread: who in their right mind would get an inspection for something as piddly as this? Silliness, pure silliness. And it IS an existing installation. If for some crazy reason their was an inspection for something as simple as this and the inspector tried to say that the conductors had to be changed to 4 wire then I'd be furious.

 

[JohnJ0906]

If I remember correctly SE would not have been acceptable back then, because I think the neutral was required to be insulated.

For NM cable, yes, but the bare conductor in SE cable is considered usable as a neutral, and was permitted as an exception.

Only if it originated at the service equipment.

 

[iwire]

Exactly what I've been thinking this whole thread: who in their right mind would get an inspection for something as piddly as this?

In many areas you would be subject to fines for doing that work without a permit.

And it IS an existing installation.

That is what is called an opinion.

What is existing?

1. The cable
   
2. The Location

What has changed?

1. The receptacle.
   
2. The breaker.
   
3. The rating
   
4. The use of the circuit.
   
5. The type of appliance.

In my opinion the inspector would be within their authority to call this a new installation ...... or not.

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

The OP is creating a NEW circuit.New breaker,new receptacle,only existing portion he is saving is a wire.A wire does not make a circuit.He can reuse the wire if its 4 wire.
While reusing an old 3 wire would work just as good as it did in 93 it changes nothing.Any new circuits need be up to date.
This will not stop a hack or handyman from doing it anyways.

 

[iwire]

do you think that people actually pull permits for a simple receptacle change out? Silly I say!!

What each of us does has nothing to do with the rules as written. I assume people come to a code forum to learn about the rules. No one needs to come to a web forum to learn how to ignore the rules. :grin:

 

[steelersman]

The OP is creating a NEW circuit.New breaker,new receptacle,only existing portion he is saving is a wire.A wire does not make a circuit.He can reuse the wire if its 4 wire.
While reusing an old 3 wire would work just as good as it did in 93 it changes nothing.Any new circuits need be up to date.
This will not stop a hack or handyman from doing it anyways.

the wire only makes up about maybe 95% of the circuit, so the wire is a pretty key part of the circuit I would think, no?

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

the wire only makes up about maybe 95% of the circuit, so the wire is a pretty key part of the circuit I would think, no?

No,it's simply part of the circuit.On it's own its not a circuit.Where did you get the 95% figure ?

I am not saying i would not do it on my own house but it in reality is using used wire for a new circuit'

If you pulled out the wire and reinstalled it in another location for the same range it would still be a new circuit.

Now if the inspector does not care then go for it.If anything bad happens i am sure he will take the blame.

 

[steelersman]

No,it's simply part of the circuit.On it's own its not a circuit.Where did you get the 95% figure ?

I am not saying i would not do it on my own house but it in reality is using used wire for a new circuit'

If you pulled out the wire and reinstalled it in another location for the same range it would still be a new circuit.

Now if the inspector does not care then go for it.If anything bad happens i am sure he will take the blame.

Just a percentage I came up with quickly. My point is that the wire comprises the majority of the circuit. And what bad could possibly happen if it was working just fine at a higher ampacity and now you are simply putting in a 30 amp dryer receptacle and a 30 amp breaker? There's no more risk of something happening doing that than anything else that's up to snuff with the code. I can understand replacing the wire to a 4 wire if you were moving the wire and had the accesibility to do so without cutting lots of holes but otherwise then it's not worth it. Have a wonderful day.

 

[480sparky]

The linear feet of conductor should not be a percentage of the circuit. It doesn't matter whether the wire is 5' or 5,000' long, it's still the same part of the entire circuit. The OCPD, conductor, and device are all equal portions of the circuit.

 

[iwire]

I can understand replacing the wire to a 4 wire if you were moving the wire and had the accesibility to do so without cutting lots of holes but otherwise then it's not worth it.

Unless the inspector says so. :grin:

 

[steelersman]

The linear feet of conductor should not be a percentage of the circuit. It doesn't matter whether the wire is 5' or 5,000' long, it's still the same part of the entire circuit. The OCPD, conductor, and device are all equal portions of the circuit.

until you show me the proof it's just a matter of opinion.

 

[480sparky]

until you show me the proof it's just a matter of opinion.

So if the wire is only 10', then it's, what, 50% of the circuit? Is 5' only 25%? Suppose the box is attached right to the panel? Is it now 1%? 5%?

Show me how you calculate what percentage of the circuit the wire is based on the length.

 

[iwire]

until you show me the proof it's just a matter of opinion.

Exactly !

It is a matter of opinion and only the AHJs will count.

 

[LarryFine]

. . . it in reality is using used wire for a new circuit'

Suppose we use my other example:

Let's say you have a 20a receptacle and breaker for a window AC unit, and replace the AC with a 15a unit. You'll replace the breaker and the receptacle, re-using the #12 wire.

New or existing? (I know the EGC/neutral debate doesn't apply here.)

 

[LarryFine]

Exactly !

It is a matter of opinion and only the AHJs will count.

And I'd still go over his head if I didn't agree with his opinion, and see what his boss's opinion is.

 

[iwire]

And I'd still go over his head if I didn't agree with his opinion, and see what his boss's opinion is.

Larry I said the AHJ, who are you going to talk to, his wife?