drilling bell boxes
- Thread starter boyle78
- Start date
- Status
boyle78
Senior Member
- Location
- new hampshire
If the manufacturer doesn't intend for us to do it that way, then we are all guilty and going to electrical hell I guess!
If the manufacturer made them with instructions that required us to use those worthless tabs.......:wink:
- Location
- Massachusetts
No, if the instructions included in the listing or labeling required us to use those worthless tabs.......:wink:
:smile:
- Location
- Massachusetts
My only point was the code rule is worded in a way that does not require us to follow every direction offered by the manufacturer
I hear what you are saying, but (ahem), let's say a manufacturer's instructions (the cheezy ones that come with the device) told me to do x,y and z, and let's say the listing didn't, well, if I did not follow the manufacturer's instructions, I'm still going to be out for a lousy time in court if someone gets hurt. So in all practicality, it seems to me that it becomes necessary to follow all the instructions, and not just what the listing says. jmshio
- Location
- Massachusetts
I hear you, there are often warranty threats as well, bit often those are illegal. (An example is an auto manufacturer trying to say the use of non-dealer service would void a warranty)
But back to the liability issue, if I install it I am on the hook for it no matter how I did it. Sometimes I will follow the directions to the letter, other times .......
steelersman
Senior Member
- Location
- Lake Ridge, VA
How can water or debris enter the box through the mounting holes when there is no penetration into the box from the mounting tabs (threaded holes in the back of the box that do not pass completely through to the inside of the box)?
I always drill them, out here 9 out of 10 times they are going on a masonary wall using wall anchors. Here's a tip: I keep a cheap $5 mini step bit in the container of wall anchors, it works GREAT for punching those KOs, and lasts forever with that thin pot metal.
I get them at the counter of a tool supply, probably Harbor freight has them too.
I get them at the counter of a tool supply, probably Harbor freight has them too.
e57
Senior Member
- Location
- San Francisco, CA
A neat trick I just learned is the use of double sided bituthane sheets, and a screw through the box. I have always screwed thru the back - but the bituthane makes a nice gasket. It also acts as a third hand while doing it.
Cow
Senior Member
- Location
- Eastern Oregon
- Occupation
- Electrician
boyle78
Senior Member
- Location
- new hampshire
If the k.o.'s on the top or back aren't in all the way or didn't get some silicone (which I think the directions DO say) I would think it would be a good place to look. Also the gaskets for the covers never seem to make great contact with the outer rim of the dang box.
steelersman
Senior Member
- Location
- Lake Ridge, VA
I know that but I was referring to what glene77is said about water and debris entering through the mounting holes. The mounting holes don't go through the box making it impossible for water to enter that way.
dezwitinc
Senior Member
- Location
- Delray Beach, FL
From the 2007 White Book:
Field Modifications
What happens to the Listing if a UL-Listed product is modified in the field?
An authorized use of the UL Mark is the manufacturer’s declaration that the product was originally manufactured in accordance with the applicable requirements when it was shipped from the factory.
When a UL-Listed product is modified after it leaves the factory, UL has no way to determine if the product continues to comply with the safety requirements used to certify the product without investigating the
modified product.
UL can neither indicate that such modifications ‘‘void’’ the UL Mark, nor that the product continues to meet UL’s safety requirements, unless the field modifications have been specifically investigated by UL.
It is the responsibility of the Authority Having Jurisdiction (AHJ) to determine the acceptability of the modification or if the modifications are significant enough to require one of UL’s Field Engineering Services staff members to evaluate the modified product. UL can assist the AHJ in making this
determination.An exception for a field modification authorized by UL is when the product has specific replacement markings. For example, a switchboard may have specific grounding kits added in the field. The switchboard is marked with a list of specific kit numbers that have been investigated for use in that
particular switchboard. Only grounding kits that are included on the marking on the product have been investigated for use in that product.
If a party wishes UL to determine if the modifications made to a UL Listed product comply with UL requirements, the appropriate Field Engineering Service can be initiated to investigate the modifications.
This investigation will only be conducted after UL consults with the AHJ to ensure that UL’s investigation addresses all areas of concern and meets all of the AHJ’s needs.
If you have any questions or would like to inquire about a Field Evaluation, contact Field Services at
+1-877-UL-HELPS, prompt #2 (+1-877-854-3577) or visit http://www.ul.com/field/index.html.
Field Modifications
What happens to the Listing if a UL-Listed product is modified in the field?
An authorized use of the UL Mark is the manufacturer’s declaration that the product was originally manufactured in accordance with the applicable requirements when it was shipped from the factory.
When a UL-Listed product is modified after it leaves the factory, UL has no way to determine if the product continues to comply with the safety requirements used to certify the product without investigating the
modified product.
UL can neither indicate that such modifications ‘‘void’’ the UL Mark, nor that the product continues to meet UL’s safety requirements, unless the field modifications have been specifically investigated by UL.
It is the responsibility of the Authority Having Jurisdiction (AHJ) to determine the acceptability of the modification or if the modifications are significant enough to require one of UL’s Field Engineering Services staff members to evaluate the modified product. UL can assist the AHJ in making this
determination.An exception for a field modification authorized by UL is when the product has specific replacement markings. For example, a switchboard may have specific grounding kits added in the field. The switchboard is marked with a list of specific kit numbers that have been investigated for use in that
particular switchboard. Only grounding kits that are included on the marking on the product have been investigated for use in that product.
If a party wishes UL to determine if the modifications made to a UL Listed product comply with UL requirements, the appropriate Field Engineering Service can be initiated to investigate the modifications.
This investigation will only be conducted after UL consults with the AHJ to ensure that UL’s investigation addresses all areas of concern and meets all of the AHJ’s needs.
If you have any questions or would like to inquire about a Field Evaluation, contact Field Services at
+1-877-UL-HELPS, prompt #2 (+1-877-854-3577) or visit http://www.ul.com/field/index.html.
mdshunk
Senior Member
- Location
- Right here.
I would hardly call breaking out the two little tits for the screw holes a modification any more than I'd call knocking out a knockout a modification. That's what those two dimples are for... screws.
K8MHZ
Senior Member
- Occupation
- Electrician
But...you're not a lawyer.
mdshunk
Senior Member
- Location
- Right here.
Of course not, but I'm also not scared of my own shadow like so many of the doom and gloom guys seem to be.
- Status