Electrician vs. Engineer

[brian john]

Engineers are no different than electricians, there are many excellent engineers and electricians, and then there are some good, some ok and some bad, it is pretty much that way in all the professions and trades, just hope your doctor is not one of the bad.

 

[JoeStillman]

Here's what I've learned over the past 30 years as a consulting engineer.

Electricians, inspectors, engineers and manufacturer's reps are all part of a regional community. For the most part, building owners are not part of that community. A building owner might put up one or two buildings in his lifetime, while the electrical community works on a new installation every day. There are exceptions for really large clients, but they tend to reinforce the point I'm trying to make. I have worked with nearly all the electrical contractors in my community, and probably will again sometime. While my first priority is always to represent my clients interests (usually a building owner or architect), I have to do that without ruining my relationship with the electricians that will be building my next project.

A truly responsible professional engineer will admit when he is wrong and work to fix his mistakes. I've met enough of the other kind, who would rather find someone else to blame. The ones who do this lose the respect of the electrical community. It pays to maintain the respect of the community. The biggest commissions I've had have been from referrals by contractors.

 

[Wire_nutz]

I have also worked with some product development and design electrical engineers that were practically geniuses. Some are very helpful, I was working on an automated manufacturing line and a robot controller crashed and lost its programming. My laptop computer would not communicate with the controller. The engineer gave me some on the job training using a pin-out box to troubleshoot why no communications was taking place between the laptop and the controller.

 

[brad9m]

Well, I am an Electrical Engineer and I have been following this forum for a while. Most of my experience has been in nuclear power generation, both in the Navy and for a utility in Florida. Now I am dealing more with Protection and Automation Engineering. I am not so naive as to believe that I know all there is to know about electrical. I learn something new on a daily basis. I appreciate all of the contributions to this forum, even the engineer bashing.:slaphead:

 

[Open Neutral]

A truly responsible professional engineer will admit when he is wrong and work to fix his mistakes. I've met enough of the other kind, who would rather find someone else to blame. The ones who do this lose the respect of the electrical community. It pays to maintain the respect of the community. The biggest commissions I've had have been from referrals by contractors.

The penultimate story of ethics and professionalism is that of the Citibank building & William LeMessurier's work.
The story is best told in the paywalled New Yorker article or reprints, but there are many other reports openly readable.

In far too few words, he found he had made a mistake, other mistakes compounded it; and the result was the building could easily have broken off half way up. With a lot of work, he got it fixed, with help from many other people including John Debutts, the chairman of AT&T.

That story is taught in engineering ethics classes.

 

[ka4koe]

I've been practicing electrical engineering for longer than I care to think about. I ALWAYS listen to electricians, especially those with more gray hair than I. This habit has saved me a great deal of wailing and gnashing of teeth over the years. The real old school tradesmen take pride in their work and know how things need to be put together.

An electrical engineering degree only means the recipient was good at regurgitating information. A PE license simply means "passed exam".

Good listening and people skills are also invaluable.

Be safe around the blue/flashy stuff, and don't let the magic smoke escape.



Philip Neidlinger, PE
Georgia 25112

 

[GoldDigger]

I've been practicing electrical engineering for longer than I care to think about. I ALWAYS listen to electricians, especially those with more gray hair than I. This habit has saved me a great deal of wailing and gnashing of teeth over the years. The real old school tradesmen take pride in their work and know how things need to be put together.

An electrical engineering degree only means the recipient was good at regurgitating information. A PE license simply means "passed exam".

Good listening and people skills are also invaluable.

Be safe around the blue/flashy stuff, and don't let the magic smoke escape.



Philip Neidlinger, PE
Georgia 25112

Very nicely said.

But two things that an EE can hopefully do is figure out why what the grey haired electrician (GHE) is doing is the right way if he does not know and also figure out, once his attention is called to it, how to do something new that the GHE has not encountered yet.

"You can't teach an old dog new tricks; but you can teach an old dog to teach a new dog old tricks."

 

[norcal]

The penultimate story of ethics and professionalism is that of the Citibank building & William LeMessurier's work.
The story is best told in the paywalled New Yorker article or reprints, but there are many other reports openly readable.

In far too few words, he found he had made a mistake, other mistakes compounded it; and the result was the building could easily have broken off half way up. With a lot of work, he got it fixed, with help from many other people including John Debutts, the chairman of AT&T.

That story is taught in engineering ethics classes.

Here is one link to the story.

http://www.crosscurrents.org/kremer2002.htm

 

[ggunn]

In far too few words, he found he had made a mistake, other mistakes compounded it; and the result was the building could easily have broken off half way up.

Caption on a large photo of the wreckage of the Tacoma Narrows bridge posted in one of the engineering buildings at the school I went to:

MISPLACED DECIMAL POINT? NO PARTIAL CREDIT.

 

[erickench]

We electrical engineers have similar problems when dealing with architects, civil/mechanical engineers, and draftsman. I go to an interview and these characters are all so interested in what the power company is doing on their side of the property line as if it was really their business. I have to sit there and explain to them that it is the Poco's responsibility and that they have their own specs and standards when it comes to building a substation. An engineer construction manager should never get involved with the design and installation of a Poco substation. His job is to coordinate with them and nothing else. Even the owner who is paying the power company to upgrade the service thinks that the Power Company should listen to his so called expert and follow his specs. Unfortunately it doesn't work that way.

 

[kwired]

We electrical engineers have similar problems when dealing with architects, civil/mechanical engineers, and draftsman. I go to an interview and these characters are all so interested in what the power company is doing on their side of the property line as if it was really their business. I have to sit there and explain to them that it is the Poco's responsibility and that they have their own specs and standards when it comes to building a substation. An engineer construction manager should never get involved with the design and installation of a Poco substation. His job is to coordinate with them and nothing else. Even the owner who is paying the power company to upgrade the service thinks that the Power Company should listen to his so called expert and follow his specs. Unfortunately it doesn't work that way.

Architects, owners, etc. maybe don't belong within the design of the substation itself, but they should at least have some input when it comes to location, and appearance. POCO can say - if you want those conductors underground they will cost $$$$.$$ more than if they were overhead, and may effect any cost to the customer. Maybe POCO wants to place substation right where it was intended to place something else in the future. Two way communication is needed for these types of issues.

 

[erickench]

Architects, owners, etc. maybe don't belong within the design of the substation itself, but they should at least have some input when it comes to location, and appearance. POCO can say - if you want those conductors underground they will cost $$$$.$$ more than if they were overhead, and may effect any cost to the customer. Maybe POCO wants to place substation right where it was intended to place something else in the future. Two way communication is needed for these types of issues.

The only input they'll have is the location of the manhole where the Poco conductors meet the owner's. It would be on the drawings. As for the actual location of the new substation the Power Company is liable to tell you take it or leave it.

 

[kwired]

The only input they'll have is the location of the manhole where the Poco conductors meet the owner's. It would be on the drawings. As for the actual location of the new substation the Power Company is liable to tell you take it or leave it.

Seeing your location, that may be true. Out here where properties are generally larger, customer and POCO are more likely to negotiate some of these kinds of things as there is often plenty of space where the substation, or any other POCO owned and maintained equipmemnt could possibly be located.