At what point would you become un-glued?

[K2X]

I'm an apprentice electrician now but in a former life I was a GC and superintendent.

Soo two weeks ago we go to start the electrical on a 10,000 ft retail parts store and the roof decking is only about half on but the super wants the lights hung, so a couple of guys start the service and a couple of guys start hanging fluorescent strips from the bar joists. Well there is snow on the metal roof decking and by 2 o'clock it is like raining inside now with icicles on the fixtures, ice on the lifts, and ice on the floors and all the trash from the other trades frozen to the floor. So we're kinda on and off there for the next week but no attempt has been made to remove the ice from the floor. So we're driving over ice, some new snow, and trash, slipping around on the lifts, chewing up the tires on the lift, etc etc. By afternoon the ice is just starting to melt a little on the top making it extra slick. Well so the last two days I'm trying to lay out the more complicated lighting where the fixtures hang at angles over shelf areas etc and of course I can't snap any lines on the icy floor and I can't get my laser to sit level on the floor without chipping out a spot for it. Then yesterday afternoon the young apprentice is carrying a bundle of pipe and slips on the floor and is limping worse and worse for the rest of the afternoon. I suspect he won't be working for at least a few days next week, maybe longer.

In my day a GC was responsible for removing ice snow, and trash from the interior of a building so the trades could do their job.

I was known to pop my cork occasionally but now that I'm older I try not to do that. Giving the the above circumstances do you think coming unglued would be justified?? I really don't want to make trouble for my boss.

 

[Cavie]

Comming unglued is not correct but working in unsafe conditions is just plane stupid.

 

[Sparky555]

OSHA is probably the one to call, but then you don't want to make trouble for your boss. I guess you don't mind who gets hurt.

 

[chris1971]

I wouldn't be doing any electrical work in those conditions and I certainly wouldn't be installing lighting or wiring until the place is closed up. Talk to your boss and let him know about the unsafe working conditions. Ask him if he is paid up on his workers comp ins.

 

[growler]

I'm an apprentice electrician.

The apprentice should not have to be in a position to come un-glued. But the forman of the electrical crew should be getting this situation under control, it is his job.

 

[480sparky]

This is where having a camera and a log book will pay off.

Document the conversations, take plenty of pictures, and use 'em as ammo when the job is done and the GC tries to backcharge you.

 

[Volta]

Yeah, what they said. Safety now . . .


Plus, 110.11. Basic code. Safety later, too.

 

[N844AA]

This is typical of general contractors these days. They don't understand that trades must do their work in a logical sequence, ie: roof before lighting.

 

[stevenje]

The apprentice should not have to be in a position to come un-glued. But the forman of the electrical crew should be getting this situation under control, it is his job.

Where is your Foreman? He couldn't possibly be sitting in the WARM and DRY job trailer drinking coffee and looking over the prints could he? Always remember that ultimately YOU are responsible for your own safety. If you think it is unsafe, speak up. If no one listens, move up the ladder.

 

[K2X]

Talk to your boss and let him know about the unsafe working conditions.

I guess you don't mind who gets hurt.

You guys are telling my boss. He reads here and used to post quite often.


Actually I already chewed the super out once. There were 2 diesel welders in the building and i told him they needed to be outside or exausted to the outside. He hollered back that they were there all week like that. I hollered that "you didn't have a roof on then you dumb @#$%". Then I yelled at him about the ice. He said the welders were about done anyway and walked away.

I'm really surprised that the job forman and the journeymen don't really consider this a problem.

And besides the saftey issue, there is the man hour issues.

Well, we do have a new forman/ lead guy starting Monday. Hopefully next week will be better.

Thanks for the replys. I'll be sure the boss reads this at some point.

 

[K2X]

I'll get some pictures Monday morning and post. They are supposed to start drywall next week and i assume they would have some heat for the finishers but you never know. :-?

 

[sparky=t]

sounds like a typical g.c. trying to do more with less, get the cheapest bid and then pile everyone in as early as they can to try to make schedules and increase thier profit. they do not care about your safety and or your bosses profit, if your boss knowingly subjects his crews to this than he is costing himself money and subjecting himself to possible fines and claims. Alot of times a subcontractor will put up with some of these issues due to the face they do not want to rock the boat, your boss / company should go over the supers head and deal with it that way rather than involving on site crews.
hope he does not have to supply and warranty the light fixtures you are installing, if I was the inspector you would be removing them and replacing with new wehn the job was dried in.

Good luck :grin:

 

[K8MHZ]

This is where having a camera and a log book will pay off.

Document the conversations, take plenty of pictures, and use 'em as ammo when the job is done and the GC tries to backcharge you.

I agree.

Before digital cameras were around, I was an apprentice working for a real butt hole foreman named Nick who had us do unsafe tasks. I complained to the hall and got fired by the foreman. Due to my being fired, I was called in front of the apprenticeship committee.

I had a log two pages long, with dates, of the infractions the foreman was guilty of.

I didn't even get to finish my list. Before I was done it was decided that I get sent to a different job, closer to home, with a different foreman.

Aside from my new foreman, I was the last person to leave that job. My new foreman and I hit it off from the start and squealing on Nick was one of the best things I ever did while coming up. It would not have been so if had had no documentation, I fear.

 

[milehiwire]

Wonder if looking at it as blessing rather than a bitch because you were able to get your hours in and be paid has been given any consideration? I know some guys we had to lay off that would be happy to head for the Springs to take your place.

You can then stay in bed in the morning.

 

[K8MHZ]

Wonder if looking at it as blessing rather than a bitch because you were able to get your hours in and be paid has been given any consideration? I know some guys we had to lay off that would be happy to head for the Springs to take your place.

You can then stay in bed in the morning.

We have a right to be safe on the job. Being asked or forced to take unnecessary risks due to a crappy economy is NOT ACCEPTABLE.

Yes, we will have to take concessions. There is no doubt about that, but placing employees in danger should be out of the question.

 

[milehiwire]

We have a right to be safe on the job. Being asked or forced to take unnecessary risks due to a crappy economy is NOT ACCEPTABLE.

Yes, we will have to take concessions. There is no doubt about that, but placing employees in danger should be out of the question.

I see no "danger" other than being wet and uncomfortable.

Like I said. The guy can stay home if he does not like it.

 

[ty]

Wonder if looking at it as blessing rather than a bitch because you were able to get your hours in and be paid has been given any consideration? I know some guys we had to lay off that would be happy to head for the Springs to take your place.

You can then stay in bed in the morning.

You can make more money on unemployment than you can in a pine box.

There is NO WAY that any of my employees would work in such an un-safe working environment.


The liability alone is not worth the risk. Not to mention the potential of not having a good employee around to complete the job when it is in ready condition.

I see no "danger" other than being wet and uncomfortable.

You obviously do not own your own business.

ICE is not just 'wet and uncomfortable'

 

[ty]

The apprentice should not have to be in a position to come un-glued. But the forman of the electrical crew should be getting this situation under control, it is his job.

BTW, I agree that it is not your job to become unglued to the GC. your concerns, should be focused at your foreman, your boss, or OSHA.

 

[K8MHZ]

I see no "danger" other than being wet and uncomfortable.

Like I said. The guy can stay home if he does not like it.

Read much?

Then yesterday afternoon the young apprentice is carrying a bundle of pipe and slips on the floor and is limping worse and worse for the rest of the afternoon. I suspect he won't be working for at least a few days next week, maybe longer.

 

[laketime]

I see no "danger" other than being wet and uncomfortable.

Like I said. The guy can stay home if he does not like it.

Typical project manager/estimator, comes out of his warm office looks around and says doesn't look bad to me. If you bid this job you would crap with the loss of labor those conditions present.