Use a 600W Toggle dimmer in a 20A circuit?

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mwm1752

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Aspen, Colo
I'm glad you agree; so do I. The problem is that it doesn't matter what we agree upon, and it doesn't matter what common sense would dictate. What matters, and it's the only thing that matters, is what the code says about it.

That's what i was hoping the Forum's experts could guide me to. The problem is that on face value, the code would seem to dissalow having any element of a circuit rated at less than the overcurrent breaker protecting that circuit in the distribution panel. Witness that is is not allowed that the wiring from a wall switch to a permanently mounted 60W closet light be less than #14 or #12 for 15A or 20A circuits respectively. The code doesn't appear to factor in that the responsibility "to make sure that the connected loads are within its capacity" has been met. It's dissallowed regardless, period, end of story.

That being said, a logical extension would be that having a 600W dimmer in circuit capable of supporting a 2400W load is similarly disallowed, but the consensus is that it is acceptable. Can anyone point me to where the code specifically addresses this issue.

I don't want to have to deal with some -thinks he knows it all building inspector- who's personal version of common sense is that it is a violation, if all I can counter with is that gee, everyone else says its ok.

And since you bring up "same thing would apply to a 15 amp switch on a 20 amp circuit" All the switches in the apartment complex I am working in are rated 20A, even those controlling only a single bulb fixture. Surely, someone feels that this is manditory, especially in view of the fact the everything else was built on the cheap. Can yoh guide me to where the code says that 15A switches are allowed where there the branch circuit won't exceed that 15A, even though 12ga wire is required throughout?

Thank you sincerely.

404.14 Rating and Use of Snap Switches
Snap switches shall be used within their ratings and as indicated in 404.14(A) through (F).

(F) Cord-and-Plug-Connected Loads. Where a snap switch is used to control cord-and-plug-connected equipment on a general-purpose branch circuit, each snap switch controlling receptacle outlets or cord connectors that are supplied by permanently connected cord pendants shall be rated at not less than the rating of the maximum ermitted
ampere rating or setting of the overcurrent device protecting the receptacles or cord connectors, as provided in 210.21(B).
 

GoldDigger

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Location
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404.14 Rating and Use of Snap Switches
Snap switches shall be used within their ratings and as indicated in 404.14(A) through (F).

(F) Cord-and-Plug-Connected Loads. Where a snap switch is used to control cord-and-plug-connected equipment on a general-purpose branch circuit, each snap switch controlling receptacle outlets or cord connectors that are supplied by permanently connected cord pendants shall be rated at not less than the rating of the maximum ermitted
ampere rating or setting of the overcurrent device protecting the receptacles or cord connectors, as provided in 210.21(B).

Hormel1144: There you have not what you were looking for or expecting to find, but what you need to see. There are limitations on wire sizes, there are limitations on snap-switches and limitations on dimmers, and they are not identical. There are also provisions that allow smaller wires (fixture wire) to be connected to a 15 or 20 amp circuit in some cases even though they would not be protected by the OCPD.
The code is restrictive, not prescriptive, so you will not find anything that says that a 15A switch can be used on a 20A branch circuit. All you will find is that in some cases (no receptacles or cord connected loads) there is nothing in the code that says that you cannot.

That is the best you are going to get, and if you want an explanation of why the code was written that way, I am not the person to provide it to you.
 
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infinity

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I am replacing a 20A toggle switch with a dimmer-toggle. It is in an apartment house where all the toswitches are 20A even if they only control a 60w closet light, am I am concerned that the buildng management (who has already demonstrated that they think they know it all when they actually know very little--the abundance of code violations attests to that) will take issue that the dimmer is not certified 20A. The fixture that the dimmer controls is not capable of exxceeding 600w so you and I both know that it s safe, I just need some help in finding where the code addresses it.


Since they know it all ask them for the code reference. They won't find one. :D
 

Hormel1144

Member
Location
NYC
404.14 Rating and Use of Snap Switches
Snap switches shall be used within their ratings and as indicated in 404.14(A) through (F).

(F) Cord-and-Plug-Connected Loads. Where a snap switch is used to control cord-and-plug-connected equipment on a general-purpose branch circuit, each snap switch controlling receptacle outlets or cord connectors that are supplied by permanently connected cord pendants shall be rated at not less than the rating of the maximum ermitted
ampere rating or setting of the overcurrent device protecting the receptacles or cord connectors, as provided in 210.21(B).

I don't mean to bust your B@//$, but whay you cite appears to require that 20A switches be used on a 20 A circuit, and doesn't allow that 15A switches can be used???!
 

don_resqcapt19

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I don't mean to bust your B@//$, but whay you cite appears to require that 20A switches be used on a 20 A circuit, and doesn't allow that 15A switches can be used???!
If the switch controls receptacles for cord and plug connected loads, then you are correct that the rating of the switch must equal or exceed the rating of the branch circuit OCPD.
 

GoldDigger

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If the switch controls receptacles for cord and plug connected loads, then you are correct that the rating of the switch must equal or exceed the rating of the branch circuit OCPD.

But if it only feeds that 60w closet light and the light socket does not have a built-in convenience receptacle the way the old porcelain surface mount sockets often did, then the 15A switch would be OK.
 

Rewire

Senior Member
I don't mean to bust your B@//$, but whay you cite appears to require that 20A switches be used on a 20 A circuit, and doesn't allow that 15A switches can be used???!

you are correct a switch cannot be used on a circuit rated above its rating so a 15 amp rated switch cannot be used on a twenty amp cicuit and a 20 amp switch cannot be used on a 30 amp circuit.
 

JDBrown

Senior Member
Location
California
Occupation
Electrical Engineer
Used within their ratings, is not protected within their ratings.
Yes, but ...

If the snap switch controls a receptacle, you have to assume that at some point somebody is going to plug the maximum possible load into that receptacle.

If it's a 15A duplex controlled by a 15A switch, that's fine as long as it's protected by a 15A breaker. But if it's protected by a 20A breaker it's not allowed. Why? Because somebody could plug an 1800W space heater and a 75W table lamp into that duplex. That's no problem for the 15A duplex or for the 20A circuit breaker, but now all of a sudden you have more than 15A going through your 15A switch. It is no longer being used within its rating.
 

iwire

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Location
Massachusetts
Yes, but ...

If the snap switch controls a receptacle, you have to assume that at some point somebody is going to plug the maximum possible load into that receptacle.

I am not into assumptions.

But a PM was sent to me pointing out that 404.14(F) backs up your veiw about switches supplying receptacles.

At the same time the need for 404.14(F) infers that for circuits that do not supply receptacles we only have to consider the load.
 

GoldDigger

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At the same time the need for 404.14(F) infers that for circuits that do not supply receptacles we only have to consider the load.

<grammar nazi alert>
Actually 404.14(F) implies that we need only consider the load in the case of non-receptacle circuits. You are the one doing the inferring based on it. :)
</grammar nazi alert>
 

JDBrown

Senior Member
Location
California
Occupation
Electrical Engineer
I am not into assumptions.

But a PM was sent to me pointing out that 404.14(F) backs up your veiw about switches supplying receptacles.

At the same time the need for 404.14(F) infers that for circuits that do not supply receptacles we only have to consider the load.
Now THAT I agree with completely. :thumbsup:
 

don_resqcapt19

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Illinois
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retired electrician
I am not into assumptions.

But a PM was sent to me pointing out that 404.14(F) backs up your veiw about switches supplying receptacles.

At the same time the need for 404.14(F) infers that for circuits that do not supply receptacles we only have to consider the load.
Yes, there is that implication, and that might be all you need. I know it is a common practice, but I haven't found any wording to specifically permit or prohibit the use a a 15 amp rated switch on a 20 amp circuit.

I have found a specific permission to use the 600W dimmer on a 20 amp circuit.
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
Yes, there is that implication, and that might be all you need. I know it is a common practice, but I haven't found any wording to specifically permit or prohibit the use a a 15 amp rated switch on a 20 amp circuit.

I have found a specific permission to use the 600W dimmer on a 20 amp circuit.

IMO the fact that the section says 'used' not 'protected' is all that is needed.

Notice all the things covered by 210.20 OCP for different equipment 210.21 but no mention of switches.
 
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