Small Electrical Contractor considering changing the way we do business.

VE Inc. said:
Accidents, broken windows, unsecured ladders / tools causing accidents is probably the culprit to our high insurance costs.
Click to expand...
When agents competitively quote policy cost they may ask for a 5 year window, but “Loss-Run Reports” may only track a 3-year window of commercial vehicle claims, and driver’s record.
 
VE Inc. said:
when it's $18,000 per year per vehicle
Click to expand...
Thats approaching 2 orders of magnitude higher than a personal vehicle policy.

My state has a minimum liability coverage law, that allows drivers to waive comprehensive, their own medical costs, and uninsured motorist from the policy.

For commercial policies, if GVW, and mileage are low, rates should be more competitive.
 
VE Inc. said:
No service work either. Seems like every AC and plumbing company in our area offers electrical service now.
Click to expand...
My clients also complain about these guys, are asking me to do plumbing & AC service, or beg for good referrals.

Employees have trouble with client satisfaction, because they don’t own the relationship, or warranty call backs.
 
Last edited:
AC\DC said:
Have you thought about doing ac
Click to expand...
Yes, but there are barriers to entry & service.

Without a C20 license, equipment manufacturers & suppliers wont sell new units, or support your service with replacement compressors, or circuit boards.

EPA cert for refrigerant & welding equip. is also needed to replace compressors.

I believe T-Stats, Ctrl Xfmrs, disconnects, and OCP are about the only parts available to electricians trying to service HVAC.
 
ramsy said:
When agents competitively quote policy cost they may ask for a 5 year window, but “Loss-Run Reports” may only track a 3-year window of commercial vehicle claims, and driver’s record.
Click to expand...
I believe claims and driver's record heavily influenced my cost.
 
ramsy said:
Yes, but there are barriers to entry & service.

Without a C20 license, equipment manufacturers & suppliers wont sell new units, or support your service with replacement compressors, or circuit boards.

EPA cert for refrigerant & welding equip. is also needed to replace compressors.

I believe T-Stats, Ctrl Xfmrs, disconnects, and OCP are about the only parts available to electricians trying to service HVAC.
Click to expand...
You're right. Johnstone Supply, a major HVAC distributor in our area, closed our account two years ago. They require an HVAC license now.
 
VE Inc. said:
You're right. Johnstone Supply, a major HVAC distributor in our area, closed our account two years ago. They require an HVAC license now.
Click to expand...
I have a massive issue with our trade and my state licensing board. Other trades are closing the doors on anyone overlapping on their work. I agree with this, it protects their members. In NJ they keep allowing other trades (plumbers, HVAC, GCs, solar installers) to overlap on electrical work. I pray for a faster retirement and tell my son to find another profession.

We work at a building where their HVAC guy is going to install (+/- 30) upsized 3 phase disconnects. Most locations have no existing disconnect. Another customer of ours has their garbage company connecting a 480v trash compactor. No experience, no license, no electricians in sight.

The electrical board does nothing. I've even had one board member who is an instructor tell me it's my fault because I don't show up at the meetings. I thought thats why we elected board members. To stand up for license holders and tradesmen. He also mentioned that they're doing the work that electricians don't want to do. That's BS, pay a reasonable rate and qualified electricians will do the work.
 
comsparky said:
I have a massive issue with our trade and my state licensing board. Other trades are closing the doors on anyone overlapping on their work. I agree with this, it protects their members. In NJ they keep allowing other trades (plumbers, HVAC, GCs, solar installers) to overlap on electrical work. I pray for a faster retirement and tell my son to find another profession.

We work at a building where their HVAC guy is going to install (+/- 30) upsized 3 phase disconnects. Most locations have no existing disconnect. Another customer of ours has their garbage company connecting a 480v trash compactor. No experience, no license, no electricians in sight.

The electrical board does nothing. I've even had one board member who is an instructor tell me it's my fault because I don't show up at the meetings. I thought thats why we elected board members. To stand up for license holders and tradesmen. He also mentioned that they're doing the work that electricians don't want to do. That's BS, pay a reasonable rate and qualified electricians will do the work.
Click to expand...
Agreed comsparky. We only had a Johnstone account because they kept unique disconnects and motor rated switches we would occasionally need quickly.

Yes sir, we've seen some of that. What you're stating is definitely over the top and should be dealt with by your board members. Examples like you shared do not seem to be as prevalent here. I personally witnessed our licensing board hand out massive fines to outdoor lighting companies (with no license or qualifying agent) and outdoor sound system companies (with no license or qualifying agent).

I've heard, but cannot confirm it's truthful, some EC's wiring new houses, condos and apartments will have a rough in crew (not electricians), wire running / pulling crew (not electricians) and wire termination / hot check crew (electricians). Not something we would ever consider.

Agreed, if we'll run concrete encased duct bank in 103 degree heat and Florida's water table, we'll do anything for a reasonable rate of pay.

Thanks for taking the time to reply.
 
I guess thats always an option, although I'm an electrician. I know my place and where my expertise lies. I just wish others would do the same.
 
comsparky said:
I guess thats always an option, although I'm an electrician. I know my place and where my expertise lies. I just wish others would do the same.
Click to expand...
I get you- but also you got to evolve- that’s like old j-man that don’t use new tools or pick the book up- at there time they were great now there slow and unproductive- as far as how are fast and loose world works now
 
VE Inc. said:
Agreed comsparky. We only had a Johnstone account because they kept unique disconnects and motor rated switches we would occasionally need quickly.

Yes sir, we've seen some of that. What you're stating is definitely over the top and should be dealt with by your board members. Examples like you shared do not seem to be as prevalent here. I personally witnessed our licensing board hand out massive fines to outdoor lighting companies (with no license or qualifying agent) and outdoor sound system companies (with no license or qualifying agent).

I've heard, but cannot confirm it's truthful, some EC's wiring new houses, condos and apartments will have a rough in crew (not electricians), wire running / pulling crew (not electricians) and wire termination / hot check crew (electricians). Not something we would ever consider.

Agreed, if we'll run concrete encased duct bank in 103 degree heat and Florida's water table, we'll do anything for a reasonable rate of pay.

Thanks for taking the time to reply.
Click to expand...
I believe the hard truth is that the special interests $$$, influence laws and staffing. There is absolutely no way for the board to police this.

And I completely agree that it's out of control.
 
ramsy said:
Yes, but there are barriers to entry & service.

Without a C20 license, equipment manufacturers & suppliers wont sell new units, or support your service with replacement compressors, or circuit boards.

EPA cert for refrigerant & welding equip. is also needed to replace compressors.

I believe T-Stats, Ctrl Xfmrs, disconnects, and OCP are about the only parts available to electricians trying to service HVAC.
Click to expand...
I can get pretty much anything that doesn't contain refrigerant pretty easily. I don't do much for HVAC servicing though. Newer units these days means unit specific parts quite often and I don't intend to stock those parts and customer wants it fixed right now when they have a problem. So I generally just stay away from it anymore other than my own equipment and select friends or family maybe.
 
ramsy said:
Well said. My most common service is replacing Start & Run capacitors.
Click to expand...
and maybe contactors.

The high efficiency stuff of more recent times however may not have any of this as they have ECM blower motors and VFD driven compressors. I don't know how unique the drives and motors are or if there are some so called universal motors one can use as replacements. Would kind of suck to have to keep some stock of all the possible parts one may need when one part only fits a limited amount of units. Used to be you could keep about three or four different blower motors on hand and would be covered for almost anything for residential furnaces anyway.
 
kwired said:
and maybe contactors.

The high efficiency stuff of more recent times however may not have any of this as they have ECM blower motors and VFD driven compressors. I don't know how unique the drives and motors are or if there are some so called universal motors one can use as replacements. Would kind of suck to have to keep some stock of all the possible parts one may need when one part only fits a limited amount of units. Used to be you could keep about three or four different blower motors on hand and would be covered for almost anything for residential furnaces anyway.
Click to expand...
Not the case at all.

The ecm blower in my Carrier system failed last summer. The complete ecm motor wasn't available, national 8 week back order. I eventually got the ecm drive end, that repair was 1500.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top