10/2 copper clad aluminum

[Roger9]

I work with my brother in law we’re a small company but we’re growing. We mainly do new construction/custom homes, one of our builders we’ve been with for 4 years now told us we need to lower our prices. They want us to also start using copper clad aluminum in all of their homes. We told them no, and they fired us and started using a bigger company who only uses copper clad aluminum.

I know copper clad aluminum is #10 gauge and I understand you have to pigtail every switch and outlet which already tells me you’re wasting time and labor rather than running copper. But I’m just curious has anyone else used copper clad? And if so is it dangerous? I know in the code book it states it’s acceptable but we only use copper and we’re never changing lol I don’t trust aluminum even if it’s plated in copper.

 

[roger]

Tell them to go pound sand. Regardless of whether you reduce your price through materials or whatever I guarantee they won't extend the savings to the customer.

 

[LarryFine]

"We want you to lower your prices because we don't want to lower ours."

Regardless of whether you reduce your price through materials or whatever I guarantee they won't extend the savings to the customer.

Of course not. If you can't increase your in-come, you have to reduce your out-go.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

One of the issues right now for CCA is that the only wire nuts listed for use with CCA are the ones sold by CopperWeld.

 

[augie47]

One point in regard to your original post. Devices are available which can be wired directly to CCA conductors.

 

[letgomywago]

One of the issues right now for CCA is that the only wire nuts listed for use with CCA are the ones sold by CopperWeld.

I don't think it'll take long for that to change. The issues with the listing I've heard are mostly ignored by AHJs so either they need more enforcement or more market share for the cca

 

[drcampbell]

One of the issues right now for CCA is that the only wire nuts listed for use with CCA are the ones sold by CopperWeld.

I imagine wire nuts cut right through the copper cladding and expose the aluminum.

 

[letgomywago]

I imagine wire nuts cut right through the copper cladding and expose the aluminum.

This has been looked into and they don't break through the copper. The copperweld ones don't have this issue and then there's always wago style connections as an option.

 

[drcampbell]

This has been looked into and they don't break through the copper. The copperweld ones don't have this issue and then there's always wago style connections as an option.

What about every other [unapproved] wire nut on the planet? Everything I've ever disassembled has had grooves cut into it.

 

[qcroanoke]

I work with my brother in law we’re a small company but we’re growing. We mainly do new construction/custom homes, one of our builders we’ve been with for 4 years now told us we need to lower our prices. They want us to also start using copper clad aluminum in all of their homes. We told them no, and they fired us and started using a bigger company who only uses copper clad aluminum.

I know copper clad aluminum is #10 gauge and I understand you have to pigtail every switch and outlet which already tells me you’re wasting time and labor rather than running copper. But I’m just curious has anyone else used copper clad? And if so is it dangerous? I know in the code book it states it’s acceptable but we only use copper and we’re never changing lol I don’t trust aluminum even if it’s plated in copper.

If they know so much about home wiring why are they subbing it out? Hire a Master, pull their own permits and cut out the middle man. (you).
You don't need that trouble.
I definitely would not want them building a home for me if they're willing to use CCA.

 

[letgomywago]

What about every other [unapproved] wire nut on the planet? Everything I've ever disassembled has had grooves cut into it.

It doesn't cut deep enough I thought the same as you till I saw it demonstrated. The copper part of it is actually thicker than I thought

 

[drcampbell]

It doesn't cut deep enough I thought the same as you till I saw it demonstrated. The copper part of it is actually thicker than I thought

I guess that's why it's called copper clad, and not copper plated. I've never actually seen the stuff, myself.

 

[gene6]

The issues with the listing I've heard are mostly ignored by AHJs

Sure keep in mind your AHJ is not liable at all for the copper clad, the installer is.
Listing wont be ignored by a forensic insurance investigator after there is an insurance claim. There are more insurance claims related to aluminum wiring, and installer defects than copper.

If they know so much about home wiring why are they subbing it out? Hire a Master, pull their own permits and cut out the middle man.

The home builder we work for for used to do that and their insurance dropped them, again too much liability.
They also had to separate the build company from the design company. It still is marketed as a design/build contractor, but the architect is now a different llc.

 

[acrwc10]

I had a general contractor ask me to lower my price and I said, "I'll see what I can do." I waited a week and said "Sorry, I can't lower my bid".
by the time they were trimming the job out, they were begging me to bid their next job. Cheap and custom do not go together.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

I don't think it'll take long for that to change. The issues with the listing I've heard are mostly ignored by AHJs so either they need more enforcement or more market share for the cca

The other manufacturers are, so far, refusing to have their wirenuts tested and listed for use with CCA. It is my understanding from the CopperWeld people, that they have tested the other existing wirenuts with CCA and they are fine, but the wirenut manufacturers are not interested in listing their products for use with CCA.

 

[Roger9]

I imagine wire nuts cut right through the copper cladding and expose the aluminum.

It doesn't cut deep enough I thought the same as you till I saw it demonstrated. The copper part of it is actually thicker than I thought

H

I guess that's why it's called copper clad, and not copper plated. I've never actually seen the stuff, myself.

I appreciate both responses! I’m still worried a wire nut would cut through the copper as well even if you use the correct wire nut made for CCA. But I plan on buying a roll and testing myself! And you’re right I guess it’s not plated in copper but there’s a very thin layer of copper bonded to the aluminum? Which sounds good but still scares me it’s mainly aluminum.

 

[letgomywago]

H

I appreciate both responses! I’m still worried a wire nut would cut through the copper as well even if you use the correct wire nut made for CCA. But I plan on buying a roll and testing myself! And you’re right I guess it’s not plated in copper but there’s a very thin layer of copper bonded to the aluminum? Which sounds good but still scares me it’s mainly aluminum.

Remember that all normal switches and receptacles are listed for CCA as is so if you do feed through where you can it'll avoid some of the issues

 

[gene6]

But I plan on buying a roll and testing myself!

Na instead buy a 100' bundle of 1/2 EMT and get really good bending pipe. As soon as I got good at running pipe I never had to worry about work, heck buy some aluminum rigid and get good at bending that.

 

[LarryFine]

Na instead buy a 100' bundle of 1/2 EMT and get really good bending pipe.

Here's an exercise for you, except this is 3/4":

 

[rambojoe]

An exercise for that pipe bender is good try, but get the spacing right... getting there though.