We have an 80amp 3ph 120/208 receptacle that we are installing outdoors. We are on the 2023 code which requires the GFCI class A protection for up to 100 amps. This has been in the NEC for 8 years so I thought these products would be readily available by now. I am not having any luck. I could not find a breaker for our GE panel nor a device that we can wire in like the Littelfuse short block which can not be used with a neutral. Can any of you point me in the right direction? Do I ask for 90.4(D) forgiveness?
120/208V 80 amp GFCI
- Thread starter cfoland
- Start date
- Location
- San Francisco Bay Area, CA, USA
- Occupation
- Electrical Engineer
Up until this recent change, the list of places it (Class A) was required in other than dwellings was really short... kitchens, bathrooms and rooftops (and rooftops in industrial facilities had an exception). These were not places where you found a lot of plug-in receptacles that large.
Bender makes a Class A GFCI protection system for this, the Lifeguard system. Get out your checkbook though...
Bender makes a Class A GFCI protection system for this, the Lifeguard system. Get out your checkbook though...
Thanks I'll take a look. Open checkbook on this one.
brantmacga
Señor Member
- Location
- Georgia
- Occupation
- Former Child
It is truly baffling to me this hasn’t been solved.
ramsy
Roger Ruhle dba NoFixNoPay
- Location
- LA basin, CA
- Occupation
- Service Electrician 2020 NEC
A Leviton high-current GFCI donut was discussed on this forum back in 2013
GFCI Protection with 220V
I have not really heard much regarding using GFCI protection on 220 V circuits. The only option I've seen for this has been GFCI breakers. I've been browsing the internet and have seen a High Current GFCI by Leviton. What are these for? Could these be used for any 220V circuit (up to 80...
forums.mikeholt.com
Whats if for?
winnie
Senior Member
- Location
- Springfield, MA, USA
- Occupation
- Electric motor research
Sadly, that part has been long discontinued.
ptonsparky
Tom
- Occupation
- EC - retired
There are Ground Fault Sensors available that will detect the 5 ma but they are not GFCI.
Minor detail, unless you're in court.
Minor detail, unless you're in court.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
My question is have there been electrocutions to justify this? Receptacles/plugs that type don't have much tendency to lose the EGC like the 5-15 and 5-20 plugs do, which IMO is one the main reasons why GFCI has long been required for those in certain situations.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
Though I don't feel GFCI should be required I don't see that NEC differentiates between pin and sleeve and other "receptacles". The one thing that maybe would exempt it is if it is supplying a feeder like you mentioned and not something that directly supplies utilization equipment.
- Location
- San Francisco Bay Area, CA, USA
- Occupation
- Electrical Engineer
It didn’t used to, it does now.
We don't often have to work under the latest 2023 code, regardless can you point me to the code reference for GFCI protection of a feeder in the 2023 NEC?
- Location
- San Francisco Bay Area, CA, USA
- Occupation
- Electrical Engineer
The big changes to 210.8(B), for "other than dwelling units", came in the 2020 Code, where they added a list of 12 locations where they are required now. 2023 just added 3 more and consolidated the exceptions to make them more readable.
27 states have adopted the 2020 Code, another 8 have now gone to 2023, so that makes 35/50 states where this would apply. New York however is not one of them, you are still on 2017. The OP is in Colorado, one of the 8 that has gone to the 2023 Code.
Thanks for the info I see the free access online it has expanded.
However 210.1 has not changed much:
"This article provides the general requirements for branch circuits..."
So I am not finding the code requirement for GFCI protection of an 80A feeder. I suppose that would be in 225
ptonsparky
Tom
- Occupation
- EC - retired
- Location
- San Francisco Bay Area, CA, USA
- Occupation
- Electrical Engineer
The receptacle defines it as a branch circuit, no?
I could have an equipment cart or skid with a 80A pin&sleeve cord to an 80A panel on the cart, on the cart is a loadcenter with breakers to various pieces of equipment and a few 120V receptacles all on the cart.
The final overcurrent devices are on the cart.
I might have various points around a large facility such as an airport where I have 80A pin and sleeve connection points to use the cart.
I'd say that 80A breakers in the building are a feeder breakers.
The final overcurrent devices are on the cart.
I might have various points around a large facility such as an airport where I have 80A pin and sleeve connection points to use the cart.
I'd say that 80A breakers in the building are a feeder breakers.
LarryFine
Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
- Location
- Henrico County, VA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
But, the cart would not be part of the premises wiring system, which would end at the connector.
Plugging in a cart with a load-center vs a cart without one shouldn't alter what the fixed wiring is.
Plugging in a cart with a load-center vs a cart without one shouldn't alter what the fixed wiring is.
The cord to the cart and the loadcenter on the cart still fall under the NEC.