1600 kW service, 3400 Amp conductors;

[herding_cats]

Yes it’s a huge bridge rectifier

 

[herding_cats]

Liquid cooled.

 

[kwired]

How do you know that? I assume it is a three phase bridge rectifier.

He mentiuoned: 1,600,000 divided by 480 = 3333.33 amps has to be single phase amps.

1,600,00 divided by 480 and also divided again by 1.732 = 1924.56 would be the three phase amps.

If DC output is 1600 kVA @ 480 volts then it will be 3333.33 amps on the DC side but three phase AC side is only 1924.56 amps.

 

[winnie]

Without derating etc. Not much voltage drop. Short distance.

You are required to derate if you have more than 3 conductors in a conduit. Doesn't matter how long the run.

Jon

 

[herding_cats]

Correct I checked. But the data sheet from Tesla has 1600 kw as demand for the 480vac primary. Thanks for that correction.

 

[herding_cats]

Ok. So 2000 amp service at 480 Vac

 

[winnie]

The demand charge is the issue here with grid connection. If you pull that kind of demand, even just 1 time, you are stuck with the demand charge for the next 11 months. We’re talking about 1 charger here. So because of the low volume of trucks, it’s impossibly expensive to charge a low volume of trucks.

Right. If you have trucks charging 24x7, then the demand charge isn't much.

If you have a truck fast charging once in a blue moon, the demand charge is huge.

Jon

 

[electrofelon]

He mentiuoned: 1,600,000 divided by 480 = 3333.33 amps has to be single phase amps.

1,600,00 divided by 480 and also divided again by 1.732 = 1924.56 would be the three phase amps.

If DC output is 1600 kVA @ 480 volts then it will be 3333.33 amps on the DC side but three phase AC side is only 1924.56 amps.

Oh right of course, sorry I glanced over that part of it

 

[electrofelon]

The demand charge is the issue here with grid connection. If you pull that kind of demand, even just 1 time, you are stuck with the demand charge for the next 11 months.

Not all utilities have that "ratchet clause" where the demand stays at the peak for months even if you don't use it. If you are investigating this for 900 locations, I think you're going to find big variation in construction cost, demand charges, etc so it might take different approaches in different areas

 

[electrofelon]

That would be single phase amps, if you deriving this from three phase then there is that 1.73 factor involved as mentioned and 1600kW three phase @ 480 volts would be 1924 amps, split across all three lines.

Funny it took till post 56 for someone to catch the amps calc math error !

 

[herding_cats]

We’re just trying to get this to make sense to the truck stop chain. They don’t see the grid connection usable to them, because of the demand charge costs. And who pays for the half-million $$ battery bank?

Another problem is what does the truck behind you do if you charge in front of them and you drain the battery from the charging station. ??

What then?

Funny it took till post 56 for someone to catch the amps calc math error !

right. I’m rusty. I’ve spent the last 12 years developing low volt HVAC controls. But yes I forgot about the square root of 3. The Tesla data sheet did not list any amperage. Only 480vac
1,600 kW

 

[kwired]

Funny it took till post 56 for someone to catch the amps calc math error !

Larry Fine first mentions it in post 50 a little more subtle but did mention it.

 

[herding_cats]

He did. My first thought was that only motor loads are calculated that way. Again my HVAC brain goes immediately to compressor and blowers. Thank you LarryFine.

I’m working on this project alone. The group review is Friday someone and would have caught that. Makes me feel better about conductor sizing and the costs of copper. The gas company is subsidizing the piping and extra valve, shutoff, yellow paint and the burial, concrete flat work.

 

[herding_cats]

 

[kwired]

We’re just trying to get this to make sense to the truck stop chain. They don’t see the grid connection usable to them, because of the demand charge costs. And who pays for the half-million $$ battery bank?

Another problem is what does the truck behind you do if you charge in front of them and you drain the battery from the charging station. ??

What then?

right. I’m rusty. I’ve spent the last 12 years developing low volt HVAC controls. But yes I forgot about the square root of 3. The Tesla data sheet did not list any amperage. Only 480vac
1,600 kW

I assuming this thing capable of charging multiple trucks at a time and has maximum rating of 1600 kW? If so unless you expect it to run at maximum rating for any amount of time I bet POCO doesn't supply you with 1600kVA transformer for it. Especially if they figure out it only sees 50% of that most of the time they likely only putting in maybe 750 kVA transformer. However from NEC perspective your supply conductors still needs be able to handle full rating as a general rule.

There is lots of services out there that have undersized POCO transformers on them in comparison to the incoming service conductors. Typical dwellings are a good example as well. Lots of 200 amp services out there and only supplied by a 15 or 25 kVA transformer which are only 62.5 and 104 amp transformers. POCO's know they won't be loaded very high and if they are will be for short duration.

 

[herding_cats]

This is a 50kW level three charger powered by an 80hp micro turbine with a recouporator hx.

Charger is really sweet it’s data driven. It knows what EV you have when you connect.

 

[herding_cats]

The data sheet for the semi charger shows only 1 charge cable. It’s rated at 1600 kW by nameplate.

 

[kwired]

This is a 50kW level three charger powered by an 80hp micro turbine with a recouporator hx.

Charger is really sweet it’s data driven. It knows what EV you have when you connect.

50kW is individual truck charging capability?

 

[herding_cats]

I assuming this thing capable of charging multiple trucks at a time and has maximum rating of 1600 kW? If so unless you expect it to run at maximum rating for any amount of time I bet POCO doesn't supply you with 1600kVA transformer for it. Especially if they figure out it only sees 50% of that most of the time they likely only putting in maybe 750 kVA transformer. However from NEC perspective your supply conductors still needs be able to handle full rating as a general rule.

There is lots of services out there that have undersized POCO transformers on them in comparison to the incoming service conductors. Typical dwellings are a good example as well. Lots of 200 amp services out there and only supplied by a 15 or 25 kVA transformer which are only 62.5 and 104 amp transformers. POCO's know they won't be loaded very high and if they are will be for short duration.

But POCOs hate intermittent power use. It wrecks things for them.

 

[herding_cats]

50kW is individual truck charging capability?

No that’s a car charger station.