210.12 Arc Fault

Status
Not open for further replies.
R

Riograndeelectric

Senior Member
Location
Lakewood Colorado
210.12(B) in wiring a dwelling unit Wet bar Receptacles and lights, is AFCI protection required for the wet bar area. 210.12 a Wet Bar.

I am awhere of 210.14 GFCI protection for wet bars.

In my opinion I do not believe a Wet Bar area requires AFCI protection

Thanks .
Cameron
:)
 
Riograndeelectric said:
210.12(B) in wiring a dwelling unit Wet bar Receptacles and lights, is AFCI protection required for the wet bar area. 210.12 a Wet Bar.

I am awhere of 210.14 GFCI protection for wet bars.

In my opinion I do not believe a Wet Bar area requires AFCI protection

Thanks .
Cameron
:)
Click to expand...

What code year are you using and what room is the wet bar located. Most areas in a dwelling need afci since the 2008 NEC
 
We are on 2008 NEC.

the Wet-bar is located in a finished Basement family room.
although wet bar is in the Family room Area 210.12 does not specifically state the area in the Wet Bar itself requires AFCI protection
Cameron
 
Riograndeelectric said:
We are on 2008 NEC.

the Wet-bar is located in a finished Basement family room.
although wet bar is in the Family room Area 210.12 does not specifically state the area in the Wet Bar itself requires AFCI protection
Cameron
Click to expand...

IMO, If the wet bar is in a family room then it needs AFCI protect. If it were in the bathroom, laundry room or kitchen it would not.
 
Read 210.12(B) very carefully. You will notice it does not say just 'rooms'.... it says 'rooms or areas.' The AHJ may say the wet bar is in the family room area.
 
I agree with you that the family room would require AFCI protect.
210.12(B) to me seems kind of Grey area.

The wet Bar is located in the family room. but 210.12(B) gives no indication of what a wet bar itself requires. what about counter top Recptacels for a wet bar
the only mention I can find is Exhibit 210.14 in the 2008 handbook but this this references GFCI protection
 
IMO, the section is quite clear. A wet bar is not an area but a piece of furniture or cabinetry that is placed in a room. In your case it is the family room. It needs AFCI
 
Dennis Alwon said:
IMO, the section is quite clear. A wet bar is not an area but a piece of furniture or cabinetry that is placed in a room. In your case it is the family room. It needs AFCI
Click to expand...

Kinda like:

Bar_Area.jpg

​
 
Thank you all for your input and knowledge. every one says AFCI protection is required. Agreed 210.12 does say rooms, area which puts the wet bar is in the family room area
I did not look at as being a room or are such as in family room but was only thinking wet bar.
thanks for straighting me out. :)
Cameron
 
Riograndeelectric said:
Agreed 210.12 does say rooms, area which puts the wet bar is in the family room area
Click to expand...
Cameron, I think you raised an interesting question. Until you raised it, I'd never focused on the idea of "wet bar". It's similar to a kitchen counter in a practical common sense kind of way, but, I don't think the NEC gives it much emphasis at all.

That is, other than needing GFCI for receptacles, the wet bar is not pinned down, in the NEC, to a specific type of area. . . like, the "wet bar area".

I agree with Dennis and 480 that the wet bar is a feature placed in an area or room, and takes on the AFCI requirement (if any) of the area or room it is located in.
 
Al, this was my thinking all along. a wet bar but not thinking wet bar in area required for AF CI protection.
part of my thinking was the wet bar is similar to kitchen area except a kitchen is defined in the NEC.

Thanks every one .
have a Great weekend.
 
Riograndeelectric said:
Al, this was my thinking all along. a wet bar but not thinking wet bar in area required for AF CI protection.
part of my thinking was the wet bar is similar to kitchen area except a kitchen is defined in the NEC.

Thanks every one .
have a Great weekend.
Click to expand...


All a ''wet bar" is, is a counter with a sink in it, why define it ? The area needs to meet the receptacle spacing requirements of "general lighting" not the SA circuit and receptacle spacing of a kitchen.
 
If the wet bar met the requirements of a kitchen (100) then it would be exempt from AFCI protection. If not AFCI protection required.

It may have to meet the requirements of 210.52(C)

Does it meet 210.52(B)? If so 210.11(C)(1) applies.

What is a similar area?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top