210.52 (f)

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georgestolz said:
If the apprentice has more weight in the boss's eyes than a licensed journeyman electrician with ethics such as you, then the boss needs to get his eyes checked. He will be able to afford the eye exam after you move on to another shop and gives the arrogant apprentice your van. :)
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Not likely, since the kid has no license due to his second DUI.

The main reason Igave him another task was that I want all of the cable installed by quitting time. I am faster than a two year apprentice.

After reading all of your replies, I feel foolish for taking flack from a kid. I must be getting soft in my old age.
 
480sparky said:
Here's a radical idea: Text message the whole Codebook to him! :grin: :grin:
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Now, that's funny. :grin:

sparky_magoo said:
I didn't get much response about the chime. How do you guys do it?
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I'll put the transformer in a closet or laundry header. Wire goes from x-former to chime and from chime to each button installed.


sparky_magoo said:
It doesn't really matter, I explained what I want and he wouldn't do it.
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Once again, he'd be sitting on the curb, waiting for a ride home at quiting time.
 
I see chime xfmers in the utility areas often times. Such as a furnace room, service room, hot water tank room area.
 
Tough Call, IMO

Tough Call, IMO

sparky_magoo said:
I have an argumetative apprentice. He wanted to feed the laundry Ckt. off of a bed rm. ckt. I said it was illegegal. I whipped out my code book. 210.52 (F), said it was legal. Am I reading the code wrong? I have always run a dedicated ckt. to the laundry.

The same apprentice said we could run the dishwasher and disposal off the SABC ckt. I couldn't find a violation in 210 or 422. He even said it was cool to power the hood off of the SABC.

Am I wrong, or do I not know how to use my code book? I am an old man. Is it possible I am cofussing code with common sense?
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I would have a stop and walk through before inspection with fix it time.
Have a footprint of job, rough sketch and "X" every fault, tell him he can fix them, mark them done or show code otherwise (after other work is fixed). Any material or specical situations you address, I'll supply you fix, (or put into order of priority, questions (Don't let him)- none- then Go... two hours.

Tell boss what your doing, I'm having the kid fix his stuff, before inspection, don't say anything else.

As far as the kids excitement for knowing things, tell him we don't guess
we look it up. Its not just tap and run, its understanding, the bigger picture of cause and effect there of, for example load calc's in respects to adding to the kitchen SABC, some of those units (micro) can be pretty big.

Just a thought...

Its always more of pleasure to have someone do what there told, you can explain cause and effect instead of having to try to work through a job that you have to talk to death.
 
I mentioned to the owner about the kid's attitude this morning. He was apalled. He told me, warn him once, then fire him. I work for a small shop. I am the only foreman. Boss said, if you don't like him, he can't work here.

The kid was full of beans. His practices were not sanctioned by the owner. The owner confided today that I am here because my predesessor was getting lazy.

We're a small shop who does top quality work in a small market. The owner gets work in this market because of his rep.

Whe I got to the job this morning, the kid was a changed man. I didn't realize the boss called him.

The super, who has known the kid for two years, asked him a question. The kid responded: ask Magoo, he's the journeyman. I was blown away.

Later on, I asked the kid to look at a box I was making up. I explained why the neutral, from a three-way, must be seperated. He listened to me. I was blown away again! Last week he would have said "I've always tied them together and it worked".

If you want to know why they had to be seperated, I will start another thread. Yes, it was all on the same CB.
 
M. D. said:
I'm glad things are working out ,... Keep an eye on him sparky ,he is not trust worthy.
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You're totally right. I will watch him like a hawk. I am new to this shop. I now know the boss will back me up. If he gets out of line, I will spank him down, not physically.

Back in the last millenium, I had a history of apprental abuse. The stories are pretty funny, if anyone cares to hear them.

I am older now and don't feel like using force to impose my will. A little bit of "the old Magoo" is going to have to emerge, if I am going to keep this guy in line. Hopefully, kid has learned his lesson and this story is done.

There will be no abuse of any kind. I will just fire him, if he gets out of line.
 
sparky_magoo said:
I didn't get much response about the chime. How do you guys do it?
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Depends on the panel location. If it's in the basement, and not in a wall, it's right on the side of the panel.

If the panel is in a finish or at least rocked wall, it's in the mechanical room.

I hate the guys who just drop the bell wire into the basement under the front door, then bring the basement pull-chain light circuit to a 4square box just for the transformer. 97 out of 100, that box is in the part of the basement that will get finished in a couple years. Now I gotta deal with it when the lower level gets finished. I like to put it somewhere where it will never need to be moved.
 
stickboy1375 said:
I install them in the basement, but check these rough in kits out for all you slab only houses...
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I live in California. We don't have basements here. Thats why I hide the transformers in closets, over the header.
 
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sparky_magoo said:
...BTW, did I mention he doesn't have a license and I have to taxi him to and fro on my own time?...
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Why is that your responsibility? I would be making him pay for the gas at least, or charge him the same as any other taxi would .... :roll:
 
sparky_magoo said:
BTW, did I mention he doesn't have a license and I have to taxi him to and fro on my own time?
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If your boss told you that you are to be his chauffeur, then your clock starts ticking the minute you pull up to his house, and stays running until he gets out of the truck at the end of the day. It is NOT when you get to the job site or shop that your days starts.
 
sparky_magoo said:
As long as I am venting, I told the kid to do the chime. He refused to do it to my specs. I gave him something else to do.

The kid wanted to instal the "tranny" in a 1 gang box and mont the chime over the box. I said this is unacceptable because the "tranny" will over heat and die. He said in his two years, he has never replaced a transformer.

I have replaced many transformers stuffed into 1 gang boxes. I install the "tranny" in a closet, over the header, inbetween the header and the top plate. This way, if the door bell button shorts out, the overheated "tranny" can't start a fire....
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They do make one that is suitable for that type of installation. NuTone, I think .... here it is:

nutone-chimekit-BK140SLPB.JPG


Edit to add link
 
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kbsparky said:
Why is that your responsibility? I would be making him pay for the gas at least, or charge him the same as any other taxi would .... :roll:
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I have a company van. To pick him up is fifteen minutes out of my way. The same to drop him off. I have to admit, the boss makes it worth my while in other ways.

I am not bragging, but there is a seious shortage of certified journeyman electricians in central California. I shouldn't snivel. I am lucky to have this job. My boss is lucky to have me. He admits this.

I do get percs which make up for taxi'ing the kid around.

Even if work was better, I wouldn't jump shops for anything.
 
Contentment can be great compensation. I, too, work in a small shop and work for a great boss. There may be better things out there, but it all depends on how it balances out to where I am. Too many things I wouldn't trade.
 
The kid's attitude came up today. He was humble for one day.

I wired the x-frmr. myself (are you happy George. :grin: Just kidding.)

The kid didn't want to deal with some of his violations.

This is going to be fun. while I wired the chime's X-frmr. I discovered the kid had stapled wires to the top of the bottom cord of a truss.

This paticular bottom cord was part of the framing for the attic accesses. So when you climb up through the A.A., you have to put your hands on his wires.

We shall see if my boss is serious. I think he is. I should have fired him, but I want the boss to spank him.
 
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