3 phase kW

[jim dungar]

They used to but not in Oregon or Washington anymore, they are all 'technicians' now, the case in WA was a complaint that the state of WA was giving state employees the job title “Engineer” improperly even though they were not licensed or registered as engineers. Nothing to do with selling services.
Now all the business cards say 'staking' (or network or whatever job) technician instead of a 'staking' engineer.

Engineer Wins Groundbreaking Case in Superior Court of Washington for Thurston County | Cairncross & Hempelmann

In a groundbreaking case in the Superior Court of Washington for Thurston County, Paul Tappel, a professional Civil Engineer, and his firm Fisheries Engineers, Inc. won a ...

www.cairncross.com

I believe that ruling applies to State/government employees and not necessarily to employers like Microsoft and Boeing.

 

[tortuga]

I believe that ruling applies to State/government employees and not necessarily to employers like Microsoft and Boeing.

incorrect, read the case:

by the Attorney General’s own admission, hundreds of thousands of individuals in the state may be improperly using the title without official credentials and restores the Board’s interpretation of the Act to preclude the use of the professional title “Engineer” by such unlicensed individuals.

 

[AC\DC]

They used to but not in Oregon or Washington anymore, they are all 'technicians' now, the case in WA was a complaint that the state of WA was giving state employees the job title “Engineer” improperly even though they were not licensed or registered as engineers. Nothing to do with selling services.
Now all the business cards say 'staking' (or network or whatever job) technician instead of a 'staking' engineer.

Engineer Wins Groundbreaking Case in Superior Court of Washington for Thurston County | Cairncross & Hempelmann

In a groundbreaking case in the Superior Court of Washington for Thurston County, Paul Tappel, a professional Civil Engineer, and his firm Fisheries Engineers, Inc. won a ...

www.cairncross.com

central Lincoln pud call them engineers still. I know for a fact none of them have a degree.

 

[jim dungar]

incorrect, read the case:

This a job opening currently published by the Washington DOT.

Assistant ITS Engineer (TE3)​

Qualifications
To be considered for this opportunity, the following are required:

• One (1) year of experience as a Transportation Engineer 2 or equivalent, such as Bridge Engineer 2 or Transportation Planning Specialist 2
• One (1) year of experience with ITS network management and the operation of Intelligent Transportation Systems (ITS) devices.
• Possess a valid Driver’s License.
• Thorough knowledge and understanding of engineering principles, methods, and practices.
• Experience with reviewing plans and specifications for complex engineering designs.
• Experience communicating technical information in written and verbal forms.
• Experience with the application of mathematical engineering formulas and equations.

 

[kwired]

Thank you all for confirming that 5 years of apprenticeship weren't a complete waste. I thought I might have been going crazy for a minute
The transformer is a 1000kVA. The utility has verbally informed me that the facilities peak usage is around 600a. Since they are giving me an amp value I decided to convert the transformer secondary to amps so (1000kVA divided by (480 x 1.73) ) gives me just about 1,204 amps. So new load plus existing load (440a + 600a = 1040a). Transformer 100% load minus existing and new load = 164a of unused transformer ampacity.

The utility hasn't been forthcoming in telling me how much their transformers can be loaded up under their policies 80%, 90%, 100%, etc. I am aware the FLA doesn't exactly translate to demand. As I know the customer is going to be using these machines at the lowest possible settings that these machines are capable of due to the specific product they are using in them. They are essentially large resistive heaters with a couple of very small motor loads for blower fans.

I would also like to mention that I myself am not an engineer, just an electrician that tried my best to pay attention when going through transformer calcs in the apprenticeship. If anyone has any tips to help improve my understanding of transformer calcs I am all ears.

Actual demand could be lower than you might think as these heaters likely do cycle as needed to maintain a temperature, or depending on how precise control needs to be may have a control that varies output to the needs of the application. The only time they possibly all draw full rating is from a cold start of all units at same time, but once warmed up the average demand may drop considerably.

 

[Hv&Lv]

Hoping someone can help me understand what I'm not understanding. So let me start by giving a bit of backround. I am about to install some 3 phase 480v pieces of manufacturing equipment, but there have been some questions as to whether or not the utility owned transformer could safely handle the new load. I figured one piece of equipment at (44a x 480v x 1.73 = 36,537W = 36.5kW). installing 10 of these so (36.5kW x 10 = 365kW). So to sum things up 480v 440a 365kW of new load.

However when I gave these figures to the utility engineer he said that I wasn't calculating the kW correctly and that all I needed to do was volts times amps. so just 480v x 44a for total of 21.12kW for one unit. He then told me that I only have to throw in the 1.73 if I'm doing the calculation from 277 volts. However that doesn't really make sense to me since 277v out of a 480/277v system is inherently single phase since as soon as you add another leg it becomes 480v.

Suffice it to say I didn't really argue with him since both his math and my math give me the answer I want which is that there is plenty of room on the transformer for this new installation. However when I did try to dig in a little with him he told me he doesn't actually have an engineering backround, but this is how they all do it in his office. Am I missing something here? I've been browsing the interwebs trying to make sure I'm not wrong in my understanding, and yes I am aware I am leaving out power factor, however I fail to see what I'm missing here. Can somebody possibly help me see what I'm missing here?

He is wrong if he told you that. As others have stated, he isn't an engineer, just someone in the “engineering” department. We have “stakers” that lay the jobs out that are in our engineering department. Sometimes they think they know more than they really do.

your formula is exactly right to figure your kW. (44A x 480V x 1.73 = 36537). (x 1.732 = 36580)

What he probably didnt explain well was another way to figure it that an engineer told him. (3 x l-gV x 44A) so 3 x 277 x 44A = 36564

they are all in the ballpark.

 

[Eddie702]

I was told if you work full time for a company/contractor you can design whatever you want and call yourself an engineer as long as the same company installs the stuff.

Where you get in trouble is if you design something for someone else and you don't install it. So you can't offer your design services to someone unless you are a real engineer.

Don't know how true that is.

 

[jim dungar]

I was told if you work full time for a company/contractor you can design whatever you want and call yourself an engineer as long as the same company installs the stuff.

Where you get in trouble is if you design something for someone else and you don't install it. So you can't offer your design services to someone unless you are a real engineer.

Don't know how true that is.

Yes, most states allow contractors to design stuff they install, however they rarely refer to it as performing engineering.

 

[electrofelon]

Yes, most states allow contractors to design stuff they install, however they rarely refer to it as performing engineering.

For example in WA, there is no requirement that electrical systems be designed by a PE, except I believe for institutional buildings. I could legally design the electrical system for a skyscraper or stadium, perfectly legal. In the city of Seattle this would require plan review and they do have a clause that proper plans be submitted and if they are not considered adequate, they can require a PE to draw them up.

 

[ggunn]

I was told if you work full time for a company/contractor you can design whatever you want and call yourself an engineer as long as the same company installs the stuff.

At least in Texas the company has to have a PE.

 

[kwired]

For example in WA, there is no requirement that electrical systems be designed by a PE, except I believe for institutional buildings. I could legally design the electrical system for a skyscraper or stadium, perfectly legal. In the city of Seattle this would require plan review and they do have a clause that proper plans be submitted and if they are not considered adequate, they can require a PE to draw them up.

I think sometimes publicly owned facilities may be required to be designed by professional architects/engineers. This can also vary from place to place and possibly the details or even value of the project are a factor into whether this is a requirement.

 

[kwired]

At least in Texas the company has to have a PE.

With no regard to the details of project? I'd guess there is criteria for when there needs to be utilization of PE services to design something.

I mean installing a single receptacle in an existing dwelling - someone still plans out what they are going to do even if there is little complication to the process and the only plan that exists in the installers mind.

 

[ptonsparky]

I already forgot what I wrote that was offensive enough to be deleted, but Ok, I'll try not to do it again.

 

[Jraef]

A friend of mine was in the Navy assigned to a fueling station and was in charge of walking around with a clipboard, tapping on gauges with the back of a screwdriver, then writing down the readings (his words). For this, he was given the title "Operations Instrumentation Engineer 2nd Class" (or words to that effect, it's been a long time since he told me this story). When he got out, he parlayed that title into a job at an oil company as an I&C Engineer, which he kept pushing to where he now works for a major Consulting firm doing refinery instrumentation system design (in Texas by the way). Not one day of college...

 

[electrofelon]

Pretty sure if you drive a train u can call yourself an engineer

 

[Tulsa Electrician]

Pretty sure if you drive a train u can call yourself an engineer

Nothing like tooting your own horn

 

[garbo]

I my area Exelon seldom will upgrade a pole transformer even if you double the load. I installed a 800 amp 240 volt service in a shop that ran 24/6 with a load of over 600 amps. There already was a 200 & a 600 amp three phase services on the pole transformer they feed the new service from. The existing vastly undersized transformer burnt out within a few months and the same exact size transformer believe did not last a year. Same Ultility company told me that #6 copper 80 year old frayed RHW was was large enough to feed a 100 & 200 amp single phase service because being it was an underground service that feed into a basement end box the ground keeps the wire from over heating.

 

[ggunn]

Nothing like tooting your own horn

I'm not allowed to blow the horn
I cannot ring the bell
But if the damn thing jumps the track
Guess who catches hell

 

[electrofelon]

I'm not allowed to blow the horn
I cannot ring the bell
But if the damn thing jumps the track
Guess who catches hell

Someone got a talking to here I imagine

 

[Jraef]

We had one nearby recently too. Nobody hurt, but a lot of people lost their cars.