50A 125/250V 4W Electric Range Recept to 20A 120V 3W Gas Range Recept

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learning101

Always learning
Location
Arizona
Occupation
Electrician
SCOPE
An existing electric range is being changed out to a gas range.

PROBLEM
The existing recept for the electric range is a 50A, 125/250V, 4W. The new range is gas and a 20A ,120V, 3W recept is needed.

PROPOSED SOLUTION
I may be incorrect with my solution and this is where I'm asking for help.

Here is what I thought of doing...

BEHIND RANGE​
1. Cut out the drywall and install a new box to the left of the existing recept box.​
2. Remove the existing 4W recept and utilize the box as a junction point.​
3. Cap the B-phase wire in the existing box.​
4. Wire-nut A-phase hot, neutral, and ground with 12-3 romex in existing box.​
5. Bring 12-3 romex into the new box.​
6. Install 20A, 120V, 3W recept into new box.​
7. Blank plate the existing recept box.​

BREAKER PANEL​
8. Remove the existing 50A, 2P breaker in panel.​
9. Cap the B-phase wire in breaker panel and label it.​
10. Wire-nut 12ga black onto existing #6 A-phase wire.​
11. Install a new 20A, 1P arc-fault breaker on A-phase in panel.​
12. Install a filler plate on B-phase of cb panel cover.​
13. Re-label panel schedule accordingly.​

QUESTIONS
1. Is there anything in the 13-step proposed solution above that I got wrong or that I've missed?
2. In the breaker panel, step #10 above, according to NEC 312.8 (A), wire-nut inside of the breaker panel is permitted, do I have that correct?

Pictures can be viewed here----->Range Recept.
 
I would likely do exactly as you spelled out although Infinity is correct in post #2.
As an alternative, you could re-identify the red conductor as an equipment ground per 250.119(B) although one could question the "ensure only qualified person" wording.
 
augie47 said:
How would that not be a violation of 250.12 ??
Click to expand...
250.12 Clean Surfaces. Nonconductive coatings (such as
paint, lacquer, and enamel) on equipment to be grounded
shall be removed from threads and other contact surfaces to
ensure good electrical continuity or be connected by means of
fittings designed so as to make such removal unnecessary.
 
I believe that Infinity has identified the only code violation with your approach. IMHO in this particular installation it is a silly technicality (the EGC was sufficient for the 50A breaker, after all), but it is still a violation.

I personally would be loathe to remove a perfectly good 50A range receptacle to provide power for the gas stove. A couple of years down the road the customer will want to upgrade to some combo of gas and electric :)

I own and am very happy with this product for this application:

-Jon
 
Little Bill said:
250.12 Clean Surfaces. Nonconductive coatings (such as
paint, lacquer, and enamel) on equipment to be grounded
shall be removed from threads and other contact surfaces to
ensure good electrical continuity or be connected by means of
fittings designed so as to make such removal unnecessary.
Click to expand...
old age or typo 210.12
 
Gene B said:
No violation of 250.122(B) since nobody increased the size of the conductors. They are oversized, but not because they were increased in size. (Kind of sounds like I'm making a joke...I'm not).
Click to expand...
I always like to see a "back door" approach that keeps me from rejecting a job. I like that one :)
 
infinity said:
By using the existing cable which has #6 conductors your EGC will be too small according to 250.122(B).
Click to expand...
That is a difficult code to understand and interpret. I read and re-read several times over. From what I understood, that code states and references of "increasing" EGC if ungrounded conductors are increased. Nowhere in that code does it mention anything about "decreasing" wire size.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding...
 
winnie said:
I believe that Infinity has identified the only code violation with your approach. IMHO in this particular installation it is a silly technicality (the EGC was sufficient for the 50A breaker, after all), but it is still a violation.

I personally would be loathe to remove a perfectly good 50A range receptacle to provide power for the gas stove. A couple of years down the road the customer will want to upgrade to some combo of gas and electric :)

I own and am very happy with this product for this application:

-Jon
Click to expand...
Thank you for the information.

To have a combo of gas and electric, and to keep the existing 50A electric range receptacle, rather than run a new, dedicated branch circuit for the 20A gas range receptacle, can I utilize and share the refrigerator circuit branch?
 
In accord with 210.52(B)(2) exception, you can feed the gas range from the kitchen S/A branch circuit.

If the refrig is on it's own circuit per 210.52(B)(1) exception, I would say you could not share it with the gas range.
 
learning101 said:
That is a difficult code to understand and interpret. I read and re-read several times over. From what I understood, that code states and references of "increasing" EGC if ungrounded conductors are increased. Nowhere in that code does it mention anything about "decreasing" wire size.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding...
Click to expand...

The standard interpretation is that if the conductors of a circuit are larger than the minimum required for ampacity, then they are 'increased in size'. In other words, if you use #6 conductors for a 15A circuit, then your conductors have been 'increased in size' relative to the #14 normally required.

Gene B provided a different interpretation which I like, that if you have _existing_ circuit conductors which you are reusing, you aren't increasing anything in size.

I could see an inspector going either way on this.

-Jon
 
There are lots of exceptions and nuances to what can go on which circuit in a kitchen. IMHO the code here has gone way too 'design manual'.

SABC circuits are required to be 20A. A refrigerator is permitted on the SABC. A gas range is permitted on the SABC.

For _specific_ appliances you are permitted to run 15A circuits. For example, you could run a dedicated 15A receptacle for a fridge, or a dedicated 15A receptacle for the gas range. But you can't use a single 15A circuit for both.

If you have a 20A circuit that feeds a single receptacle for the fridge, you could call it a SABC and add the range to this.

-Jon
 
learning101 said:
Thank you for the information.

To have a combo of gas and electric, and to keep the existing 50A electric range receptacle, rather than run a new, dedicated branch circuit for the 20A gas range receptacle, can I utilize and share the refrigerator circuit branch?
Click to expand...

Also I didn't realize that the link I posted just came through as the word 'amazon.com' rather than the normal link with preview, so not sure if you noticed it.

The item I was referring to is a 14-50 to 5-15 adapter plug with a built in 15A fuse. I just plugged it into the electric range receptacle and plugged the gas range into it.

-Jon
 
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