abandoning the general use of 120 vac wiring throughout residences

[don_resqcapt19]

... the warming trend that for at least the last 20 years has been palpable to any observer. ...

While I agree there is an issue and a warming trend....there is no way that 20 years, or even a 1000 years is a warming trend give the age of the earth.

 

[wwhitney]

While I agree there is an issue and a warming trend

I agree that a warming trend alone doesn't say anything about its cause. But couple that observed trend with a plausible scientific mechanism, and other observations that match what that mechanism predicts, and that's good evidence of the cause.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[mtnelect]

When people living in the beach communities are requesting air conditioning, something is going on.

 

[ggunn]

I understand, but what is being proposed, especially without included nuclear will not be possible for many many decades....if the carbon thing is real, there is no chance of saving the planet without increased nuclear.

Just what is it that you think is being proposed, exactly? Solar and wind alone cannot satisfy the world's rapidly increasing demand for energy, and I don't know anyone who thinks they can.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

I agree that a warming trend alone doesn't say anything about its cause. But couple that observed trend with a plausible scientific mechanism, and other observations that match what that mechanism predicts, and that's good evidence of the cause.

Cheers, Wayne

Again, 20 years cannot depict a trend in the temperatures.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Just what is it that you think is being proposed, exactly? Solar and wind alone cannot satisfy the world's rapidly increasing demand for energy, and I don't know anyone who thinks they can.

many of the proposals from the green side are pushing for exactly that.

 

[ggunn]

many of the proposals from the green side are pushing for exactly that.

Show me one.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Mark Jacobson, a Stanford professor of civil and environmental engineering and the director of its Atmosphere/Energy Program, has been promoting the idea of all renewable energy as the best way forward for more than a decade. His latest calculations toward this ambitious goal were recently published in the scientific journal Renewable Energy.

 

[wwhitney]

Again, 20 years cannot depict a trend in the temperatures.

20 years does depict a trend, it's a 20 year trend. The warming trend is 140 years, though. I brought up 20 years because I think of that as the time period over which it's been palpable to the average person.

So if we have an observed 140 year trend, the question is whether it's a random excursion (which has happened), or there's an underlying reason, which means the trend can be expected to continue. That's the part where the scientific explanation of the trend, along with other observations confirming that mechanism, lets us distinguish the two possibilities.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[wwhitney]

Mark Jacobson, a Stanford professor of civil and environmental engineering and the director of its Atmosphere/Energy Program, has been promoting the idea of all renewable energy as the best way forward for more than a decade. His latest calculations toward this ambitious goal were recently published

Sounds like it's fair to say that a small minority of proposals from the "green side" are for all renewable energy. When you dislike something (for whatever reason, good or bad), it's easy to pick out the most extreme example, rather than a representative example.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[ggunn]

Mark Jacobson, a Stanford professor of civil and environmental engineering and the director of its Atmosphere/Energy Program, has been promoting the idea of all renewable energy as the best way forward for more than a decade. His latest calculations toward this ambitious goal were recently published in the scientific journal Renewable Energy.

Well, OK; an environmental engineering professor at a prominent university obviously knows a lot more about this stuff than either I or (I suspect; correct me if I am wrong) you. If he says it's possible, maybe it is.

 

[Besoeker3]

It appears the UK is no longer perusing Nuclear fission, they have switched to Nuclear fusion and backed it up with a massive amount of funding.
The first plant is supposed to output a net gain of 500MW.

STEP - One mission. One vision. One planet.

STEP is the UK’s pioneering technology and infrastructure programme that will develop, scale and deliver fusion energy by building a prototype powerplant at West Burton site in Nottinghamshire.

step.ukaea.uk

Yes but peanuts relatively. Dinorweg in Wales is a pumped storage system that is 1,8000 MW. It's the largest of those but still very small.

 

[wwhitney]

If he says it's possible, maybe it is.

Judging from the abstract and a quick scan of the introduction, the article is not saying it will definitely be possible. Rather it is addressing the question of whether a 100% renewable (the article counts hydropower in that) grid with sufficient storage would be stable or whether it would lead to increased blackouts. I pasted in the abstract below.

Cheers, Wayne

This study analyzes 2050-2051 grid stability in the 50 U S. states and District of Columbia after their all-sector (electricity, transportation, buildings, industry) energy is transitioned to 100% clean, renewable Wind-Water-Solar (WWS) electricity and heat plus storage and demand response (thus to zero air pollution and zero carbon). Grid stability is analyzed in five regions; six isolated states (Texas, California, Florida, New York, Alaska, Hawaii); Texas interconnected with the Midwest, and the contiguous U.S. No blackouts occur, including during summer in California or winter in Texas. No batteries with over 4-h storage are needed. Concatenating 4-h batteries provides long-duration storage. Whereas transitioning more than doubles electricity use, it reduces total end-use energy demand by ~57% versus business-as-usual (BAU), contributing to the 63 (43-79)% and 86 (77-90)% lower annual private and social (private + health + climate) energy costs, respectively, than BAU. Costs per unit energy in California, New York, and Texas are 11%, 21%, and 27% lower, respectively, and in Florida are 1.5% higher, when these states are interconnected regionally rather than islanded. Transitioning may create ~4.7 million more permanent jobs than lost and requires only ~0.29% and 0.55% of new U.S. land for footprint and spacing, respectively, less than the 1.3% occupied by the fossil industry today.

 

[mtnelect]

The California Energy Commission is having an uphill battle trying to convince all state utilities to give up control of their power systems to them. LADWP recently sent a letter opposed to this concept.

 

[tortuga]

Yes but peanuts relatively. Dinorweg in Wales is a pumped storage system that is 1,8000 MW. It's the largest of those but still very small.

It appears they think the optimal size fusion plant will need to be 1 - 2.5 GW:

On the size of tokamak fusion power plants | Philosophical Transactions of the Royal Society A: Mathematical, Physical and Engineering Sciences

Figures of merit for future tokamak fusion power plants (FPPs) are presented. It is argued that extrapolation from present-day experiments to proposed FPPs must follow a consistent development path, demonstrating the largest required leaps in intermediate ...

royalsocietypublishing.org

They are thermal plants, so an existing coal or gas plant can be changed to fusion relatively easily.
Private VC firms are pouring a ton of money into fusion here in the states.
1 gram of fusion fuel will produce about 90,000 kWH or about the same as 11 Tons (~9979 kg) of coal.

 

[jmellc]

I found a few old kerosene lanterns and candles at a flea market the other day. Also, a few old type irons that heat on the hearth. I knew I was wise to buy the stuff. Now I can go off the grid.