Another fire alarm question...

[MichaelGP3]

Is installing a duplex outlet inside the fire alarm control panel for purposes of powering a laptop computer used for program downloading & troubleshooting said fire alarm allowed? Lets assume that no available outlets are nearby.

 

[Buck Parrish]

Yes, as long as all other nec articles regarding wiring methods are met. Including 110.3(b)

 

[iwire]

Is installing a duplex outlet inside the fire alarm control panel for purposes of powering a laptop computer used for program downloading & troubleshooting said fire alarm allowed? Lets assume that no available outlets are nearby.

I am going to go with no. 110.3(B)

And even if you could get a manufacturer to say yes it could not be supplied from the circuit supplying the panel.

760.121(B) Branch Circuit. The branch circuit supplying the fire
alarm equipment(s) shall supply no other loads. The location
of the branch-circuit overcurrent protective device
shall be permanently identified at the fire alarm control
unit. The circuit disconnecting means shall have red identification,
shall be accessible only to qualified personnel,
and shall be identified as “FIRE ALARM CIRCUIT.” The
red identification shall not damage the overcurrent protective
devices or obscure the manufacturer’s markings. This
branch circuit shall not be supplied through ground-fault
circuit interrupters or arc-fault circuit interrupters.

 

[nhfire77]

Is installing a duplex outlet inside the fire alarm control panel for purposes of powering a laptop computer used for program downloading & troubleshooting said fire alarm allowed? Lets assume that no available outlets are nearby.

Are you asking to justify it or advocate it?

Beyond the NEC directly, the panel probably needs to be listed for installation. I'm sure UL would have a good laugh before confirming the the listing is voided by installing non-listed non compatible equipment in the enclosure.

I have installed unusual non compliant items in panels, as per the AHJ (special switches and buttons). If asked the AHJ would probably disallow it, safe or not.

 

[nhfire77]

I am going to go with no. 110.3(B)

And even if you could get a manufacturer to say yes it could not be supplied from the circuit supplying the panel.

Yes and the laptop is not "fire alarm equipment" if that comes up. Unlike a UL listed desktop computer that would be remotely connected for networking, but that's completely different.

 

[jewellfish]

Outlet in enclosure

Outlet in enclosure

It is my understanding that modifying a fire alarm enclosure in any way not specifically allowed by the manufacture voids the enclosure's listing. So putting something inside that is not intended by the manufacturer is not copacetic. However, wiring up something temporary, as needed,...who would care?

 

[nhfire77]

If it were temporary and you were able to get away without damaging it, then it never happened. If you were to blow the panel, your screwed. I wouldnt be the guy doing that.

Was the OP referring to a temp install?

 

[del91574]

It is my understanding that modifying a fire alarm enclosure in any way not specifically allowed by the manufacture voids the enclosure's listing. So putting something inside that is not intended by the manufacturer is not copacetic. However, wiring up something temporary, as needed,...who would care?

That is true, so much so with UL it even includes the knock out holes (although impractical in practice 99% of the time).

 

[gadfly56]

That is true, so much so with UL it even includes the knock out holes (although impractical in practice 99% of the time).

The Siemens XLS series has a connection point for the laptop power and they sell the adapter cable. It has to be a Dell-style two-prong connector for the power brick. Way handy when you've got to spend 90 minutes downloading voice files to eight remote transponder panels.

 

[nhfire77]

The Siemens XLS series has a connection point for the laptop power and they sell the adapter cable. It has to be a Dell-style two-prong connector for the power brick. Way handy when you've got to spend 90 loading voice files to eight remote transponder panels.

I've never been a fan of Siemens, didn't like the interface. Hard for fire department and authorized maintence men, IMO. However, that is really awesome.

 

[MisterCMK]

Our UL auditor recently went through and mentioned this to me with the duplex outlets in the panels for programming. He said no dice on them.