Another receptacle location thread/poll

Another receptacle location thread/poll

  • Yes, the NEC does require a receptacle here

    Votes: 59 74.7%

  • No, the NEC does not require a receptacle here

    Votes: 13 16.5%

  • Good question, I am not sure

    Votes: 7 8.9%
  • Total voters
    79
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Looks to me like two receptacles would have easily handled this:
  1. One at the left in the side of the support wall for the landing to the "down" stairs.
  2. One at the right in the box under the first riser of the "up" stairs.
Too bad they didn't catch it at "rough".
 
It's not a wall space, therefore it's not subject to 210.52 (A)(1) or(2). It's a glass partition only, and it's been established that it is not a hallway. No receptacle required.
 
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Dennis Alwon said:
I say it needs a recep. even without the glass wall and had a railing. Charlie will definite disagree on that point.
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Actually, you made two points, and I disagree with both. (1) I do not consider this to be a wall, as constructed, and (2) My interpretation of the NEC wording, as written, is that it would not require a receptacle, if there were a railing there instead.

I suspect that most of you who read that #2 part are preparing to leap into action, with your fingers barely touching the keyboards, as you prepare to quickly quote to me the code sections that I just got wrong. But wait a moment, I would ask, and consider this: Look at the architectural plans for the second floor of this house. You come to this vertical thingy that I will not name "wall," and you look at both sides of this thingy, as shown on the plans. Would you see two rooms, with this thingy in the middle? No, you would not. You would see one room, and then an opening (i.e., for the staircase). This thingy is not a "room divider." There are railings that are room dividers, and there are railings that are not room dividers. This is one the later type: one of the not-a-room-divider types. So the words that say something like, "the space afforded by fixed room dividers such as . . . railings" do not apply here.
 
480sparky said:
A wall is a wall is a wall.
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That is true. And also true is, "a non-wall is a non-wall is a non-wall."
480sparky said:
The NEC doesn't say a wall can only be made of certain materials.
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It doesn't need to. I don't need the NEC to tell me what a wall must be made of, before it counts as a wall. I have beaten my head against enough of them to tell one when I run into it.
480sparky said:
It's a wall.
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Put me down for a "no" vote, on the basis of my disagreement with that statement.
 
charlie b said:
Actually, you made two points, and I disagree with both. (1) I do not consider this to be a wall, as constructed, and (2) My interpretation of the NEC wording, as written, is that it would not require a receptacle, if there were a railing there instead.
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And the beat goes on and on and on....:D

Charlie if that so called vertical thing was of 2x4 and sheetrock floor to ceiling would you still say this "wall" would not need an outlet? I suspect you would.

BTW- you are so predictable. :D:D
 
I say no recpt. needed, to me those are fixed panels ( of glass ) and are not on the

exterior wall of the building. 210.52(A)(2)#2
 
Dennis Alwon said:
Charlie if that so called vertical thing was of 2x4 and sheetrock floor to ceiling would you still say this "wall" would not need an outlet? I suspect you would.
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Now there you got me wrong. With 2x4 studs from floor to ceiling and covered by sheetrock, I would definitely call that a wall. And given that it is obviously at least 2 feet wide, it needs at least one receptacle. But please take note that this postulated wall has two sides, the other being part of the stairwell. What NEC article addresses the question of whether it needs a receptacle on the other side, the side opposite the living room, the side that frames out the stairwell? :cool::roll:
Dennis Alwon said:
BTW- you are so predictable.
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Apparently not!:wink::smile:
 
wbalsam1 said:
I don't know. I'm now thoroughly confused. I've just looked up the definition of "wall" in the dictionary.........and it sure looks like I've put my foot in my mouth.
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I just read through my dictionary, and it is a very thick one, so it must contain the truth. :roll: It certainly had a lot to say about the word "wall." And my foot is nowhere near my mouth. True, it did include one definition that would not exclude a vertical sheet of glass from being described with the word "wall." That does not mean that any time you see a vertical sheet of glass, you see a wall. I often hear the word "window" being used to describe such constructions.
 
Well I guess you are not as predictable as I thought. :smile:

Now the function of a 2x4 wall with sheetrock is no different then a glass partition or "wall". It seems totally contradictory to require a recep. in one situation and not in the other.
 
charlie b said:
It's a glass partition, one that shares its purpose with a railing, a safety barrier to prevent someone from falling down the open stairwell.
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So a '2x4 southern-yellow-pine / 1/2" gypsum board / joint compound / paint' partition would not require a recep?
 
480sparky said:
So a '2x4 southern-yellow-pine / 1/2" gypsum board / joint compound / paint' partition would not require a recep?
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I believe that if the space between the living room and the stairwell was divided by a partition (not going from floor to ceiling) then a receptacle would not be required in this divider since the code specifically mentions "wall" at 210.52(A)(1)&(2).:smile:
 
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