Another worker lost their life

[charlie b]

I did a quick Internet search, and found very few details. The incident was about a month ago. One thing that struck me was this quote that I found on several web sites:

Power to the building had to be cut before emergency crews could access his body, according to the report.

Now, someone please tell me why they couldn't cut the power before the incident took place!

 

[iwire]

One thing that struck me was this quote that I found on several web sites: Now, someone please tell me why they couldn't cut the power before the incident took place!

Before the accident

Electrcian: I need to shut this plant down to do my work.

Management: We can't do that, it will cost us too much.


After the accident

Fire Department: Tells POCO to cut power, does not even consult management.

 

[Besoeker]

I did a quick Internet search, and found very few details. The incident was about a month ago. One thing that struck me was this quote that I found on several web sites: Now, someone please tell me why they couldn't cut the power before the incident took place!

Well said that man.

 

[jusme123]

So sorry to hear that. Nobody should ever die because they got out of bed one morning and left to go earn an honest day's living.

X2

 

[dionysius]

Before the accident

Electrcian: I need to shut this plant down to do my work.

Management: We can't do that, it will cost us too much.


After the accident

Fire Department: Tells POCO to cut power, does not even consult management.

Then the Electrician should contact the Fire Dept and let them explain to Mgm why power must be cut prior to event in future.

Unfortunately this person who is dead will never get the chance again.

 

[meternerd]

We had a poster at work...."Last Car in the Lot"...shows a lone car in the middle of an empty employee parking lot. Simple message that you'll never forget. Don't risk it! Go home to your family EVERY night!

 

[iwire]

Then the Electrician should contact the Fire Dept and let them explain to Mgm why power must be cut prior to event in future.

How cute, yeah that will work out splendidly for the worker.

 

[dionysius]

How cute, yeah that will work out splendidly for the worker.

Ok.....even if the worker is fired (which seems to be your trepidation) he is still alive and is still an electrician so he can get another job with new and improved management.

 

[Besoeker]

Ok.....even if the worker is fired (which seems to be your trepidation) he is still alive and is still an electrician so he can get another job with new and improved management.

Fired for doing the safe thing wouldn't fly here. The employer would be in front of a tribunal.

 

[iwire]

Ok.....even if the worker is fired (which seems to be your trepidation) he is still alive and is still an electrician so he can get another job with new and improved management.

There are avenues for the worker, going to the fire department is not one of them.

Fired for doing the safe thing wouldn't fly here. The employer would be in front of a tribunal.

It happens where you live too, don't try to fool yourself.

 

[Besoeker]

It happens where you live too, don't try to fool yourself.

If you mean unsafe work, then I'm sure it does happen.
Most of my work was in the industrial sector with major companies where you wouldn't even get through the gate without all the PPE and an approved site safety passport.
Any work required a permit to work and a method statement. That's not to say accidents didn't happen.

Quite a few years ago a friend got very badly burned. He didn't heed the warning notices we had put on our the panels and didn't isolate all the supplies - including the 700Vdc.
He was off work for months and then the board of directors suspended him when he got back.

Fortunately, such events in my field were rare. I've known of two in fifty years. Commercial and domestic I don't have much experience with.

 

[iwire]

If you mean unsafe work, then I'm sure it does happen.

No, I mean workers being fired for refusing to do unsafe things.

Sure, you will be able to point to examples where companies got caught and in trouble for doing those things, just like I can here.

But the reality is people do get fired here and where you are for refusing to do unsafe things and many times the company gets away with it.

Of course no company says that is why they fired someone, they say they are downsizing, or find some other reason. That is the reality of blue collar work.

 

[Besoeker]

No, I mean workers being fired for refusing to do unsafe things.

Sure, you will be able to point to examples where companies got caught and in trouble for doing those things, just like I can here.

But the reality is people do get fired here and where you are for refusing to do unsafe things and many times the company gets away with it.

Of course no company says that is why they fired someone, they say they are downsizing, or find some other reason. That is the reality of blue collar work.

Here it would go before an indusrial tribunal. If it was considered unfair dismissal and unsafe working would certainly be considered as that, then the employer would face penalties.

I've been to a few of these tribunals. Not all in an official capacity - it was part of the business masters degree. In all cases, they were found in favour of the employee.

 

[gadfly56]

Here it would go before an indusrial tribunal. If it was considered unfair dismissal and unsafe working would certainly be considered as that, then the employer would face penalties.

I've been to a few of these tribunals. Not all in an official capacity - it was part of the business masters degree. In all cases, they were found in favour of the employee.

Can you explain a bit about how they work? I don't think we don't have anything like that over hear, unless union grievance procedures might be comparable.

 

[markebenson]

Just saw on EC&M a contractor electrocuted at commercial building last week in Phoenix . Don't know the details exactly about what happen . Did want to say I still hear electricians talk about how they still work it " HOT " . This is especially true with the small contractors . Been told by one journeyman his boss tell's them ( I thought you were a Electrician ) when they talk about shutting down power ...

I dont agree with what the person was told but i do need to say something.

As general practice someone should not work on something hot for the purpose of liablity of the ELC, if they do they should not discuss that, but among veterans of their experience, I am fine with them doing that but we don't tell.

I work with ELC in their 50s and 60s that can change an outlet in less then a minute hot and they can do this safer than someone that was trained to "not work on something hot". But don't discuss thiswith young folks!

Why?

Because people today are on the job that don't have the qualification to be there.

Example:

Foreman said it is safe to work on this because" it is not hot. " The foreman says this based on the breaker being shut off to the particular circuit. The worker contunues not knowing better and guess what goes in to a 3 phase box in an outside environment and get electrocuted.

Sad thing is ELC owner might not be liable because reasonable protocal was followed.(tbd by a judge)

Well...

Many contractors can and do get away with this till the day they die. Then what?

I am here because I follow the site founders protocol. - my faith in God!


Anyone that is working on the job should be able to determine if they are doing things safely or not. If they cannot do that then I must be present while that person works or that person can work under me by someone that I would trust my own life with this job if I was to work under them.

This work can be lethal or safe based on qualifications to do the job am I not correct? I like to hire or tran qualified persons period!

Hot-Cold Its rhetoric to avoid liablity in my opinion. Why on earth would this even be a topic?

I do not leave anyone alone on the job that cannot derimine whether is is safe of not.

Looking forward to replies.

 

[Besoeker]

Can you explain a bit about how they work? I don't think we don't have anything like that over hear, unless union grievance procedures might be comparable.

Sorry. I should have responded to this.

https://www.gov.uk/employment-tribunals/when-you-can-claim

 

[iwire]

And the bonus is that then the employer puts on his angel face to the regulatory and investigative agencies, points to the "official" training course and policy manual and says the employee violated company policy.

Of course.

At the same time any worker with a clue knows that and it is on then not to make that decision.

My experience has been the company I work for does not put pressure on us to work hot. However many of us choose to because it is easier.

 

[ActionDave]

...My experience has been the company I work for does not put pressure on us to work hot. However many of us choose to because it is easier.

My opinion is that's the only reason any of us do it.

No one has ever forced me or shamed me into working hot. There have been times where I was just flat out too lazy to climb back down the ladder and walk allll the way back to the power room to turn off a breaker. As I've gotten older I'm about a thousand times more willing to make that walk.

 

[Besoeker]

No one has ever forced me or shamed me into working hot. There have been times where I was just flat out too lazy to climb back down the ladder and walk allll the way back to the power room to turn off a breaker. As I've gotten older I'm about a thousand times more willing to make that walk.

Totally agree.
LOTO.

 

[Fulthrotl]

My opinion is that's the only reason any of us do it.

No one has ever forced me or shamed me into working hot. There have been times where I was just flat out too lazy to climb back down the ladder and walk allll the way back to the power room to turn off a breaker. As I've gotten older I'm about a thousand times more willing to make that walk.

the closest i've come to dying was 'cause i didn't want to get off the ladder and walk
6' to the switch. 110 volt can lights in a commercial t bar ceiling.