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Karl H

Senior Member
Location
San Diego,CA
My question is for those that do design work using AutoCAD.
What is a typical lineweight you guys use for symbols,ckt.lines etc?
I've been referencing the numerous plans I have from 30x42" to 36x24"
sheet size at 1/8=1' to 1/4=1'. It looks like most of the lineweights
are .40mm,but that seems too thick. I've checked the properties from
CAD drawings from various engineers and can duplicate everything except
the lineweights. I don't have a plotter yet to do a print test.

Any help would be appreciated.
 
Karl,
New stuff (dark) I plot at 0.01"
Existing stuff (light but still visible) I plot at 0.005"
The translation of these line weights to your printer is also an adjustment. If I use these line weights with a different printer, it comes out crazy.
Configure your printer and then play with the line weights. We have a chart (.dwg file) that we use that has each AutoCAD color labeled and then we plot it on a perspective plotter to see how it comes out.
 
I'd read help, index, inside your AutoCad version pen plotter, pen settings.


When you create a plot style table, it is important to remember that it can be used with many different plotters and that the plotter and mode determine what parts of the plot style table are enabled.
  • When using a pen plotter with user assigned pens, the virtual pen number and any color assignments are ignored.
  • When using a pen plotter with automatically assigned pens, pens are selected based on entity color and entity lineweight. Virtual pen numbers are ignored.
When using a raster plotter in raster mode, the physical pen number and the virtual pen number are ignored.
  • When using a raster plotter in virtual pen mode, everything except the virtual pen number is ignored.
Most printers work of HP language, and Plotters run of of one of the big 4 Calcomp, Houston Instruments, HP, or postscript.

Think of this as a script that the you can set up once and make it your default, with either a pen or plotter, I'd use Color means weight; color on screen will be a desired pen weight.

This file is read and run againest what is being sent to the printer or plotter, everytime.

You must call you local printer / plotter service and find out what of the big three they use. Or you will get very foriegn and undersired results.
They should tell you what model of plotter that you'll need edit and set up
for yourself.

With a printer or a plotter, you've have to get some test sheets out.

A friend just sends the base drawing that he x-ref's in, to one color which will plot grey @ 90%, his line work is 3-4 weights, a weight for loop lines and heavier for a Symbol, recpetical, switches.

Hope that helps, good luck.
 
oce plotter

oce plotter

The company I work for just bought a new plotter. It is from a company called OCE. It doesn't use ink, it uses toner beads that are made of some sort of plastic. The plotter melts the plastic (toner) and it crystalizes on the normal bond paper. It is water-proof. It does not wipe off even when you wet it. We can also use plotter paper made from Tyvek, that is viturally indestructable, and the resolution can be what ever you want it to be. In other words you can regulate the amount of toner that goes on to the drawing. It also plots a normal (economical) drawing in 30 seconds...it is a lot faster than our other HPs.
 
To Ron and Cadpoint, Thank you both very much!
The CAD class I took was for Mechanical Engineering.
So I'm trying to adapt my knowledge to electrical design,engineering,etc.
So please bare with me.
The way I was taught, was to create a layer with the lineweight already
determined. If I created a "New Power" layer I would set my lineweights
at .40mm's so that anything I drew would be printed at .40mm's. Due to the
advice I've recieved from you two, I think I'm going about it the wrong way.
I do not have a plotter yet, but I've already done a few drawings that
have been thru plan check. I think my drawings could be a lot better
and I've put a lot of time into learning CAD and design. My classmates are
ME's and do not understand the electrical side of CAD drawings. I really
appreciate the help! Do you guys create blocks or layers in the "Default"
mode and adjust it in plotting?
 
Karl,

The easist thing to do is contact the engineering firms that you work with and have them send you their plotting ctb file. Test plot a couple to see how the line weight print on new & existing equipment. Create pdf files with your drawings and bring those to your printer for checking. I also work with line weights the same as Ron they work well.

JWC
 
Karl H said:
To Ron and Cadpoint, Thank you both very much!
The CAD class I took was for Mechanical Engineering.
So I'm trying to adapt my knowledge to electrical design,engineering,etc.
So please bare with me.
The way I was taught, was to create a layer with the lineweight already
determined. If I created a "New Power" layer I would set my lineweights
at .40mm's so that anything I drew would be printed at .40mm's. Due to the
advice I've recieved from you two, I think I'm going about it the wrong way.
I do not have a plotter yet, but I've already done a few drawings that
have been thru plan check. I think my drawings could be a lot better
and I've put a lot of time into learning CAD and design. My classmates are
ME's and do not understand the electrical side of CAD drawings. I really
appreciate the help! Do you guys create blocks or layers in the "Default"
mode and adjust it in plotting?
Click to expand...

There are free electrical library's out on the web, You can download for free or maybe a fellow reader here can drop you their symbol library, I don't have one.

I wanted to get out the major aspects of plotting 1st, there's really a gagel of stuff that will and can confuse one.

Well First of, I drove on the other side of the street, I'm not an Acad jockey. I was a MicroStation Dude.

So based on that, I might be totally wrong to tha Acad world or chain of thought but here goes.

I'd draw you symbols based on 1/8" scale and scale to 2 when you go to a 1/4" scale. Try 6-9" or 9 to 12" at 1/8" scale" so you create at the symbol 1/8" tall. This is how It worked for me.

What I'm trying to say if your happy with that scale, the scale that your read per size using an architect scale is what size you should creat you your block at. Again I'm not an ACAD blue blood...

I drew in true units of feet and inches if I wanted a plot area of 36" x 42".
I'd multiply by those number by 8 (for 8th in. scale) - thus I'd make a box 228 X 336. For 4 in scale- 144 x 168...
this was the extent of the plot area. Theres also a dead zone of where the wheels need to use another place the reepective ssmaller size the inside the larger square thus the true plotable space. Your printer also has limits of printable area.

Yes, there is several ways to set-up both your drawings and your plotter and even printer.

I had to go read up on plotters just to draw on old knowledge.

I use to Edit my HP plot Configure file in note pad the File that I created as your's will be sitting out there
with the approciate Acad file extension.

Take a break every 45 minutes to a hour, you be better at it...
 
Last edited:
some comments/suggestions. Hope they're helpful...
  • Always draft in Model Space in REAL WORLD UNITS. If your doing resi or small-medium commercial, set your units to inches. If your doing something bigger, say football field or larger, go for feet.
  • do your plots from paperspace. Put your title block on paperspace
  • use a viewport while in paperspace and set a scale to that viewport. You can use multiple view ports on a paperspace layout
  • Once you are happy with your viewport, lock it so you don't accidentally zoom in or pan around
  • You are on the right track with setting lineweight by layer. We use layer coloring as was mentioned above. It works out better for plotters
  • If you paln to send drawings to someone else to x-ref in, then keep all your notes in model space. If you are the last step, then use model or paperspace for your notes, whichever works better for you.
  • Also mentioned above... plot styles are your friend. Some repro houses may even have one they will pass along to you as their house standard. You can also try doing a google for "Default R14 pen assignments.ctb"

Depending on what version you have and how much work you expect to do, you may want to look into annotative blocks for your commonly used symbols. You can set the size of the block and text associated with the block to change size depending on what your viewport scale is.
 
I normally draw things with lineweight of 0.010" (in Model Space).
Sometimes use 0.012".

For heavier lines, I will offset a line (in Model Space) several times, using an offset factor of 0.0125", or 0.025".
This keeps things constant across platforms and Plot configs (driver, pen assignment, printer languages, media size, etc.)

Most Blocks get placed in Layout Space, on top of the XREF Base Template.
Lighting Fixtures are some of the very few Blocks placed on the Base Template in Model Space.
This is for dimensional layout purposes.

Text can be challenging at times, so I place text on "Layouts" only (not on XREFs unless the XREF is 1:1 scale - like Panel Schedules).

Colors used for lines & Blocks are:
* Black ("White" against a Black workspace),
* Red,
* Blue,
* Yellow,
* Green,
* Cyan,
&
* Magenta.
Use a "Tan-ish" color (color 41) for most text.
Gray (color 8 & 9) is used for existing to remain items.

As mentioned previously, there are gazillions of free Blocks ready for download. Look at some of the popular CAD Shareware sites.
If you E-mail / PM me, I will send some Blocks your way!


Scott
 
For existing items I use screening, not a thinner lineweight. Looks nicer.

Also, on text use a thinner lineweight than for objects. Text will be more crisp and easier to read.
 
Per National Cad Standards (NCS):

(1) Red 0.007
(2) Yellow 0.010
(3) Green 0.014
(4) Cyan 0.014
(5) Blue 0.20
(14) Burgundy 0.028
(6) Magenta 0.039
(7) White 0.055
(8) Gray 0.028

Majority of jobs I work on are used with NCS standards, however I also work in Navy and USACE which have a bit different requirements.
 
Great suggestions, Help this man out ... my memory is refreshing itself!

If this keeps up, I'll have to do something else. As the crowd yells, Please!

A good sign of a good economy is opening for Drafters.

In your search of stuff, you might also find the US Army Corp of Engineers, standards.
 
Thank you guys, you all have provided me with some very usefull information.
I have a few other questions but, I'm busy applying what you guys have
taught me. If you guys have anymore to share I am listening.
Thank you all very much!:smile:
 
Interesting, we seem to do things a little bit different at our firm, granted it is small. I set my ltscale to 48" for 1/8 scale drawings and let it rip. We use a few lisp routine with layers that I am assuming have the required lineweight.
 
Forgive my error above,

(5) Blue 0.20 should be 0.020. Was typing too fast and not paying attention. :D
 
pbeasley said:
If you paln to send drawings to someone else to x-ref in, then keep all your notes in model space. If you are the last step, then use model or paperspace for your notes, whichever works better for you.
Click to expand...

If you do this, make sure you put your notes on a different layer!!!

There is little more frustrating that getting a drawing you have to xref with all someone else's notes in model space and on the same layers with the model.

Steve
 
Keri_WW said:
Screening reduces the saturation of the color, e.g. dots per area. It serves to make the lines lighter.
Click to expand...

When you edit you pen table to assign line weights to colors or use object line weight you can select a percentage of screening.

100 is black and is normally used. You go down from there, 90, 80, 70 etc.

30 or 50 is a fairly light gray line. Looks A LOT nicer and is easier to tell existing from new using screening than thinner line weights.

Even on new buildings I re-assign colors on the architectural background and make the floor plan screened. Makes the electrical stand out.
 
Here are two examples from a fire alarm demo plan I am working on now.

In one version the floor plan is .35mm line weight and 50% screened. The other the floor plan is .25mm line weight and 100% black.

I think screening is much better looking. The fire alarm devices stand out much better. Even better for text. Best of all, on lighting plans I can screen the grid so you can see it but it does not affect visibility of the lighting plan at all.

-b
 
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