Balcony lights

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celtic said:
It's not your money :D, so of course you don't.
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You really want to drag this out? :grin:

It not required by the NEC plain and simple.

celtic said:
210.70(A)(2)(b) may apply.
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No, there is no 'may', 'might', 'possibly' there, it can not apply without grade level access.

Ask if the inspector if you want.

The OP can ask if the inspector if he wants. (I suspect he is already knows he can:cool: )

I would not, it has nothing to do with it not being my money or not. (If it's not on the bid plans it's not my money anyway. ;))

I would not ask about this light on a balcony any more than I would ask if the light in the living room needs to be GFCI protected.

BTW (All the condos I used to wire had lights on the balconies....they where on the plans.)
 
OK, it seems that no one has seen a balcony without a light, neither have I.

However, my Architect has asked me to delete balcony lights since he has not allocated space to mount them.

So now as the electrical designer I'm trying to determine my exposure if I follow his direction.


dSilanskas Yes you do need an outdoor fixture. Every door needs an outside light regardless

Do you have any further backup for this?
 
Now I have seen it all....(ok, not "all")

IMHO, a light fixture is required to be by means of egress - I always saw a fixture by a door, why dig deeper?

On one of my nightly walks with my kids, I passed 2 homes that were built within the past year or so by the same GCs, ECs, PCs, etc ....both inspected by the same individual/s....

...one had a front porch light ....one didn't.

Both have been occupied for months/minimum one-year.


I may not like it, I don't agree with it, but it appears a light outside a door/egress is NOT a requirement.
 
celtic said:
. . . it appears a light outside a door/egress is NOT a requirement.
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I guess the real question is whether every door is a means of egress. If the balcony is too high to jump from, it's not egress to me.

However, if a light is desired by he who foots the bill, so be it. If there's no wall space to either side, how about adjoining walls, above the door, or overhead?
 
I had an Inspector Fail an addition I wired, I installed a light at the front door, but not the back, (the back door led to a deck with low voltage post lights that were controlled by a photocell) so I had to explain the situation to him, no biggie... he just missed the decorative deck lights...
 
Per the NEC, it's only required for egress locations with grade level access per 210.70(A)(2). There might be a local ordinance that would require them, but probably not likely. I deleted them from my project.
 
i always thought if there is a door leading outside, ground level or not, there has to be a light. but i guess u would have to call the inspector on this subject.
 
cloudymacleod said:
but i guess u would have to call the inspector on this subject.
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No, you would not 'have to call the inspector' you can read it in the NEC.

The NEC only requires lights at exterior doors with grade level access.

210.70(A)(2)(b)
 
iwire said:
No, you would not 'have to call the inspector' you can read it in the NEC.

The NEC only requires lights at exterior doors with grade level access.

210.70(A)(2)(b)
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Bob, you said it all way back at post #15. No exit to grade no fixture required. Also no outdoors receptacle required at this second story balcony with no access to grade level. :)
 
The question really is if the light fixture is required or not...it is evident by 210.70 that it is not required by NEC.

But... there could be local codes that change this and that would mean calling the AHJ to find out. I think that is what Celtic was trying to say. I do not see the harm in calling the the AHJ a whole lot of times. The guys call us all the time for clarification, interrupting my nap time every day :)
 
Pierre C Belarge said:
But... there could be local codes that change this
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I agree that is a likely possibility or building codes etc.

I think that is what Celtic was trying to say.
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Perhaps but he kept referencing the NEC.

I do not see the harm in calling the the AHJ a whole lot of times. The guys call us all the time for clarification, interrupting my nap time every day :)
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Getting hold of an inspector on the phone in this area is not an easy task, pretty much imposable from my experience.

(And I don't think they are napping :D )
 
iwire said:
Getting hold of an inspector on the phone in this area is not an easy task, pretty much imposable from my experience.

(And I don't think they are napping :D )
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The company I work in (I am one of the principles) has a system where the contractor can call us from 7 am til 5 pm Monday -Friday. I get calls on my cell as early as 5 am and as late as 10 pm. The EC is calling to leave a message...thats right, I allow messages on my cell. (it is filled every day). I answer as often as possible based on the type of inspection I am performing or if I am in a meeting. This is not just a benefit to the ECs, but to me as well. I get to go to the inspection and find code compliant work, as the call erases most of the chance of not passing an inspection. Easy for the EC and easier for me. :)


There are days I could easily nap, but my cell rings like every 5 mins, so the nap is not long enough. The nap comes with age...I love a good 20 min nap, I sometimes will do that right in front of my computer as I sit in the chair...I can nap on a picket fence :) :)
 
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There have been times where I wish I could get the inspector on the phone, some have certain hours when they are supposed to be in the office but the reality is many of the town inspectors are part timers and have full time jobs either running an Electrical contracting company or working for an EC.

They are good guys just very busy. :)
 
LawnGuyLandSparky said:
Must a balcony have an outlet?
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Not that I am aware of.

210.52(F) requires at least one receptacle outlet accessible from grade.


If it does, but there's no stair or means to reach grade, must it be GFCI'd?
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If it's outside at a dwelling unit 210.8(A) requires GFCI protection.
 
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