Band width

ptonsparky

Senior Member
Is there a simple way to discover what device(s), in my recently and temporarily full home, is using the most bandwidth? My 8 year old home wireless router is not keeping up? Suggestions?

Using my cells hot spot at the moment.
 

hbiss

EC, Westchester, New York NEC: 2014
Your WiFi can only handle so many devices at once depending on the WiFi access point built into your router or your separate access point. At some point speed starts to drop off and it has nothing to do with one device hogging the bandwidth. I'm not a big fan of router/WiFi all-in-one combinations primarily because the router is probably going to be at some location that won't provide optimum WiFi coverage. Also, combination router/WiFis don't usually have the features (for both for the router and WiFi) and power that a separate router and access point can provide.

That said, I would consider that an 8 year old router isn't helping you.

-Hal
 

PaulMmn

Senior Member
Data Over Cable Service Interface Specification, or DOCSIS,

Data Over Cable Service Interface Specification, or DOCSIS,

I'm assuming you have a cable or other high-speed connection available for your Internet service. The Data Over Cable Service Interface Specification, or DOCSIS, is what my (Spectrum) cable / ISP uses. You have to use a modem authorized by the cable company; you can buy your own or rent one of theirs (business accounts must use one of theirs).

Speed depends on the model of modem you choose; more $ is faster. :) Quoting from https://highspeedexperts.com/home-networking/what-is-docsis-and-why-does-it-matter/:
"Channel bonding allows for the aggregation or combination of several downstream and upstream channels to deliver these much-improved speeds across the board. With channel bonding, the more channels that are present, the better, so for instance, while a 16 downstream by 4 upstream setup is fast, a 24 x 8 system can be even faster."

Remember the good 'ol days when you could hear the modems talking-- first a whistle, then a low-pitched growl, then a high-pitched growl? That was your modem activating the highest speed link your phone line could stand. 'Channel Bonding' creates several of those links, and aggregates them into a single, faster, link.

I miss hearing the modems talk.
 

hbiss

EC, Westchester, New York NEC: 2014
I'm assuming you have a cable or other high-speed connection available for your Internet service...
I'm assuming that all that is true and good. I don't think the OP is saying his internet speed is the problem though he could certainly check it easy enough. (speedtest.net) If it were me I would get a decent small business router to go after his cable modem and a separate WiFi access point and locate it somewhere central to where his devices are.

-Hal
 

Sierrasparky

Senior Member
What is the fastest speed your provider has provisioned your service.
As others have stated the older Modems don't have the number of bonded channels that modern ones have. If you are with a cable provider you need a DOCSIS 3.0 or greater capable modem. With I would say at least 8/4 channel. That is 8 downstream and 4 up. You can get better but form much usage it will suffice. I personally with go with a 16/4 as I will never pay for the Gigabit or even 400 service that is currently available so no need for a 32/8.

That said also be wary that your older devices may not be able to communicate at the faster rates. The bottleneck is that the modems and routers wifi do not provide the greater bandwith to the older WIFI protocols such as B,G,. So you could have Gigabit speed but slow at the device. unfortunately you need to keep up with the tech in this respect.
 

winnie

Senior Member
Something else important to check is interference from other wifi networks in your neighborhood.

I was having problems with my wifi, and it turns out that while my signal strength was fine, the neighbor's wifi was interfering with the signal. I used 'netspot' from a phone to identify the least congested channel and adjust things. I still have problems but it is a big improvement.

-Jon
 

PaulMmn

Senior Member
Wireless connections are fine if that's all you've got, but you can always wire the house for Ethernet! A wired connection will (in most cases) always be faster than WIFI (or BlueTooth). For a desktop machine, it makes sense-- because it's not likely to be hauled out onto the patio! Even laptops can use a wired connection-- just put an outlet (with a dangling cable) next to your favorite chair and plug in!
 

ptonsparky

Senior Member
We have wireless internet via dish from a point about 8 miles away. IDR the speed, but certainly not in the gigabit range. Not the slowest either. My nearest neighbor is 1/4 mile away.

The idiot light on my router that says we have communication is usually ON but recycling power to both the router and the switch helps for a while. Probably wouldn't have to cycle the switch.

I requested all phones have the open apps closed. We do have two ROKUs going now but the TVs are not always on when we have issues. Early morning with only me actively online is just as likely to be a problem as evenings with everyone home.

A new router could possibly help but the choices are mind boggling. IMO, it would be easier to pick a new spouse.
 

ptonsparky

Senior Member
The house is wired. Main TV is wired. Office is wired. Two IPads, 2 Roku, 1 tablet, 1 laptop, and at times 7 cell phones are not. Oops, forgot the Well monitoring and VFD but those are wired.
 

hbiss

EC, Westchester, New York NEC: 2014
We have wireless internet via dish from a point about 8 miles away.
Hold on now, that's a completely different ball game. What kind of dish and who provides it? Usually with that kind of setup you can't have very high expectations.

-Hal
 

myspark

Senior Member
My comments in RED:


Is there a simple way to discover what device(s), in my recently and temporarily full home, is using the most bandwidth? My 8 year old home wireless router is not keeping up? Suggestions?

Using my cells hot spot at the moment.


Replacing an 8 year-old router will not increase your bandwidth. Bandwidth is what you've signed for with your ISP.

Since you are asking for suggestion, I would say. . . subscribe to a T1 commercial line account. . . that will give you 1.544 megabits per second of data delivery that is 60 times faster than home modem.. It is also symmetrical with speed in both directions (upload and download.)
Be ready to spend up to $1200 a month subscription though.
…….

Your WiFi can only handle so many devices at once depending on the WiFi access point built into your router or your separate access point. At some point speed starts to drop off and it has nothing to do with one device hogging the bandwidth. I'm not a big fan of router/WiFi all-in-one combinations primarily because the router is probably going to be at some location that won't provide optimum WiFi coverage. Also, combination router/WiFis don't usually have the features (for both for the router and WiFi) and power that a separate router and access point can provide.

That said, I would consider that an 8 year old router isn't helping you.


But you can use a repeater that you can install at any location in your premises that can handle reduced speed that is also attenuating the signal that you think is compromising traffic.

………………………………..
Data Over Cable Service Interface Specification, or DOCSIS,
. . . I miss hearing the modems talk.
The older non-DSL moderm goes thru a handshake routine. . . hence the noise we hear every time we would make connection. Before your PC can communicate and send data from the server, they “talk” to each other. The server will check if your PC is capable of handling data that is being requested—the size of file and whether your PC has the speed to receive the requested file [data] in a timely manner. When both agree, the packets are sent.
This is to avoid bottlenecks when the packets are being streamed and also the condition of your network to make sure the integrity of the packets being delivered are intact for error-free data.
………
I'm assuming that all that is true and good. I don't think the OP is saying his internet speed is the problem though he could certainly check it easy enough. (speedtest.net) If it were me I would get a decent small business router to go after his cable modem and a separate WiFi access point and locate it somewhere central to where his devices are.


Yes you the can check the speed of your data delivery by going to a website that offers this service free of charge. You can check to your PC to your heart's content but you can't change the bandwidth.
The problem with these free sites is, hackers use them to infiltrate your PCs library and leave apps and install trojans to corrupt your files. . . not all of them do, but for the most part. . . that's what they do.
I use the checksum that comes with the Operating System. These hackers usually originate from Eastern Europe.
I use LINUX, a variety of UNIX.
-………
Something else important to check is interference from other wifi networks in your neighborhood.

I was having problems with my wifi, and it turns out that while my signal strength was fine, the neighbor's wifi was interfering with the signal. I used 'netspot' from a phone to identify the least congested channel and adjust things. I still have problems but it is a big improvement.

Yes, even an operating microwave oven can adversely affect bandwidth.
…………

. . . .A new router could possibly help but the choices are mind boggling. IMO, it would be easier to pick a new spouse.


The house is wired. Main TV is wired. Office is wired. Two IPads, 2 Roku, 1 tablet, 1 laptop, and at times 7 cell phones are not. Oops, forgot the Well monitoring and VFD but those are wired.
……...

In essence, your house is a LAN [local area network] which is managed by your router. When you login to a site, your router will enable all your devices that you have given privileges to access the web through the password.
Each device has its own signature and assigned a MAC address that is unique. When a device wants access to particular site, your router is the one that will get into action initially. It will then tell the server to start delivery.
The packets that are delivered will go into a cache and “circles in the ring” and check which device had requested the data. The first one on the ring [assuming it is a token-ring network] will reject the packet if it is not the requester and it will pass it on to the next device until it reaches the correct destination.

In the event that the file [ data] is too big for the device.. the router will give the instruction to the server to pause until the device is able to catch up. This is also to prevent congestion.
………
As a side note:

I surmise OP lives in a remote area with no fiber optic. . . the reason for the satellite-based ISP. Wireless network does have its disadvantage over the hard-wired ethernet.. .the speed doesn't compare with wired.
The problem [slow throughput] could get even worse come June 11 this year when the FCC mandated ban on “Net Neutrality” instituted by the previous administration. . .when this ban comes to full effect.

The new FCC commissioner [an IT geek] argues that Net Neutrality goes against the principles of free enterprise. ISP's should have the choice of providing options to consumers.

With “Net Neutrality”. . . it is analogous to controlling a landlord from increasing rent. . . even if the request is in line with cost of living.
Any further increase must be approved by authorities. [duh]

The idea of having Net Neutrality is to provide people in rural areas equal access to websites at an even keel with people living in big cities.

Along with this total ban on Net Neutrality, people in rural areas will suffer most. . . but they can purchase “ala carte” package” which they pay extra for enjoying the privilege of having fast internet.

Welcome to America.

Most countries don't throttle bandwidth. South Korea for one has no restriction on how long users use the internet and they have the fastest bandwidth in the world.
 

PaulMmn

Senior Member
A couple of comments on 'myspark's comments:

"Replacing an 8 year-old router will not increase your bandwidth. Bandwidth is what you've signed for with your ISP."

Sometimes replacing your old router does improve your bandwidth-- you just have to agree to pay your ISP more each month. They will either send you a new modem (usually with a built-in router), or give you a list of approved devices you can choose from. I think my ISP would let me use a faster modem, but wouldn't let it use the higher speed unless I offered them more money!

If you have a separate router (that's the section with multiple jacks to plug in ethernet cables, or that runs the in-house WiFi connection), it has to be at least as fast as the modem, or you don't gain anything.


re: the start of the connection talking...

The modems talk (with my cable modem there's no speaker, so you can't hear it talking to the modem at the ISP) to agree that both ends can talk at a certain speed: "do you understand me if I talk this fast?" >yes< "How 'bout now?" >yes.< They do this until one end or the other can't be understood at a higher speed.

Unfortunately, in my experience the ISP doesn't care if a file can be downloaded in a timely manner-- if you want to download a Windows update over a dial-up connection, no problem from the ISP! :)

And if the file fills up your hard drive, oh well...
 

flatlander

Senior Member
You have some decent speed for a small household. If you are doing multiple video streaming then you are going to run into issues. 15-20 Is fine for one person using video services. Heck for years I ran Netflix on 7.
But now we have HD Tv's with 4k streaming. Those take 25 plus. You really need a ISP that gives 50 to not have buffering. When we went to 100 mbps we had to upgrade the router as it did not have the throughput to the WiFi.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Hold on now, that's a completely different ball game. What kind of dish and who provides it? Usually with that kind of setup you can't have very high expectations.

-Hal
When you live in the middle of nowhere sometimes that kind of service is about as good as you can get.

Line of sight is critical between your "dish" and the site it is aimed at. Distance is a little bit of an issue sometimes. Don't know about latest systems (if your provider even has latest equipment) but used to be around 10 miles was their limit - might work beyond that but may be at a slower speed.

I have switched from a service like OP has to one that uses same signals as cell phones. Line of sight isn't critical, just the signal strength and other issues you may have with a phone.

I had been on the other type system for several years, it was about only choice for me other than satellite services when I first got on it.

When I switched the old service provider kept telling me my router was the problem. New routers did not fix the problem. Talked to some neighbors using the same system from same tower and they were having similar problems. My belief was they were having equipment issues at the tower but either didn't know or wouldn't admit it.
 

kwired

Electron manager
We have wireless internet via dish from a point about 8 miles away. IDR the speed, but certainly not in the gigabit range. Not the slowest either. My nearest neighbor is 1/4 mile away.

The idiot light on my router that says we have communication is usually ON but recycling power to both the router and the switch helps for a while. Probably wouldn't have to cycle the switch.

I requested all phones have the open apps closed. We do have two ROKUs going now but the TVs are not always on when we have issues. Early morning with only me actively online is just as likely to be a problem as evenings with everyone home.

A new router could possibly help but the choices are mind boggling. IMO, it would be easier to pick a new spouse.
"Rise Broadband" the provider by any chance?
 
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