blown in insulation

[letgomywago]

Old cloth covered wiring with rubber insulation is a safety hazard. If disturbed, the insulation will fall apart and exposed open wiring will result.

How old is old I've seen bad 15 year old NM-B and perfect condition 100 year old knob and tube that still has give. It depends on the condition of the space its in and other factors like moisture and sunlight from windows or proximity to heat sources. It's subjective and gets to a point of "you do you" as a contractor. I've done device replacements on old 2 wire and knob and tube and had 0 issues. These circuits got GFI breakers on them so if there was a short in the multi circuit switch and outlet boxes they'd trip. When working with old stuff you have to draw a line for sure but not everyone is able to do what you are expecting and I've never had a customer ever be refused home insurance so long as they had their old zinsco, FPE, or true fuse box replaced with anything modern. The replacement of just the panel doesn't even trigger adding afci and gfci in the 2020 code which you're now under.

 

[James L]

over-lamped incandescent fixtures

That's the phrase that escaped me

 

[James L]

100 year old knob and tube that still has give

I've seen that a few times. It's really like going back in time when the fabric still feels new.

 

[PaulMmn]

That's why people are leaving California. We have very stringent code standards, based on energy efficiency. It's all electric, no gas appliances.
In California if you have a 60 - amp panel, you will have to up - grade to at least a 200 - amp panel.
Old wiring "Romex" wiring can't handle it.

Unless you're talking about old Romex conductors not being up to moving to a new panel, upgrading to a new panel shouldn't affect old wiring-- only wire being replaced is from the meter to the panel. Existing circuits should have circuit-appropriate breakers; no problem.

 

[ggunn]

That's why people are leaving California. We have very stringent code standards, based on energy efficiency. It's all electric, no gas appliances.
In California if you have a 60 - amp panel, you will have to up - grade to at least a 200 - amp panel.

Upgrade it if what happens?

 

[James L]

up - grade to at least a 200 - amp panel.
Old wiring "Romex" wiring can't handle it.

???

Amperage doesn't get pushed through from the panel, it gets drawn through from the load.

 

[ggunn]

???

Amperage doesn't get pushed through from the panel, it gets drawn through from the load.

Except when you are talking about PV systems, which are current sources.

 

[LarryFine]

Except when you are talking about PV systems, which are current sources.

But the current will still be a function of voltage across load resistance, won't it?.

 

[mtnelect]

Wholesale houses in California only stock 200-amp panels now, it takes a special order to get 100-amp panels. Is that the same in other states ?

 

[ggunn]

But the current will still be a function of voltage across load resistance, won't it?.

Sort of; they are related by Ohm's Law but voltage is a function of current. If you connect a PV system through wiring of X ampacity to the grid, there will be voltage drop in the wiring and Ohm's Law will be preserved. If you then double the ampacity of the wiring (cut the resistance in half), the voltage drop will be halved and the current will remain the same; Ohm is still happy. With a voltage source, V and R are independent variables and I is dependent. With a current source I and R are independent and V is dependent.

 

[readydave8]

As to insurance company and cloth covered romex

When we bought a house in Florida a few years ago, insurance company had access to HI report

Our rates were higher due to cloth covering, but they didn't refuse to insure

 

[letgomywago]

Wholesale houses in California only stock 200-amp panels now, it takes a special order to get 100-amp panels. Is that the same in other states ?

100 amp main breaker panels are common and used in detached garages and additions often. Sometimes they're cheaper than main lug too depending on breaker space.

 

[rwood]

thanks for all your input

 

[curt swartz]

Wholesale houses in California only stock 200-amp panels now, it takes a special order to get 100-amp panels. Is that the same in other states ?

I assume your talking about Combination Service Entrance Devices?

I just checked with one of my supply houses and they have (18) 100 amp and (41) 125 amp CSED's in stock.

 

[mtnelect]

I assume your talking about Combination Service Entrance Devices?

I just checked with one of my supply houses and they have (18) 100 amp and (41) 125 amp CSED's in stock.

Thanks, that is useful information. On service upgrades I tell the customer the size of a 200-amp combination service. When they realize the foot print size they are astonished. But, if they want increased capacity for solar panels and other loads, they have no other choice.

 

[jmellc]

In my opinion ... Don't walk but run away from old wiring. It is unsafe, and the insurance companies will not insure in California.

I rewired 2 houses because insurance company would not insure knob and tube. No insurance issues I ever saw with any form of Romex, old or new. If I were in insurance underwriter, I would likely exclude BX, as it is often is worse shape than K/T.

 

[letgomywago]

I rewired 2 houses because insurance company would not insure knob and tube. No insurance issues I ever saw with any form of Romex, old or new. If I were in insurance underwriter, I would likely exclude BX, as it is often is worse shape than K/T.

The old knob and tube ends up being ok if kept away from squirrels the old BX is a death trap.

 

[OldBroadcastTech]

The demand for increased electricity continues. It will be an all-electric world for everyone, not just California. Do you have the electrical capacity to meet your future needs ?

"Do you have the electrical capacity to meet your future needs ?"

It's not my homes capacity that I worry about.

It is whether the 1970-ish transformers and undersized spans of wire between poles, serving the neighborhood, have 'the capacity'..........

 

[PaulMmn]

"Do you have the electrical capacity to meet your future needs ?"

It's not my homes capacity that I worry about.

It is whether the 1970-ish transformers and undersized spans of wire between poles, serving the neighborhood, have 'the capacity'..........

That's where mini-solar farms on everyone's roofs will help...

 

[kwired]

Old wiring "Romex" wiring can't handle it.

sure it can, but some of it won't be 14 or even 12 AWG

and if you need more thab 4 AWG you switch to SE cable or some other method.