Brown, orange, yellow, or brown purple yellow?

[tortuga]

Chattanooga

I am not seeing that in their electrical code:

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Looks like they only have about 4 amendments to the NEC.

 

[tortuga]

Thanks, I'm currently on a project in Murfreesboro, guess I should call the local inspector.

Their code amendments are here:

https://www.murfreesborotn.gov/DocumentCenter/View/8974/2018-Code-Ordinance

Scroll down to about page 14

 

[tortuga]

The San Francisco electrical code required purple instead of orange for the high leg.

Looks like they still do:
San Fran code amendments:

(a) Means of Identification. The means of identification for conductors #8AWG or larger shall be permitted to be by separate color coding, marking tape, tagging, or other approved means. Conductors of any size in cable assemblies may be suitably identified at all termination, connection and splice points. Conductor insulation in raceways shall contain continuous color pigment for circuit wire sizes # 10 AWG and smaller.

Phase Identification Colors for Branch Circuits shall be as follows:

(1) 120/240 Volt 3-Wire Single Phase Systems – “A” Phase Black, “B” Phase Red.

(2) 120/208 Volt 4-Wire 3-Phase Wye Systems – “A” Phase Black, “B” Phase Red, “C” Phase Blue.

(3) 120/240 Volt 3-Phase Delta Systems – “A” Phase Black, “B” (High Leg) Phase Purple, “C” Phase Red.

Information Note: New Construction or Complete Remodel of an Existing Building

(4) 120/240 Volt 3-Phase Delta Systems – “A” Phase Black, “B” Phase Red, “C” (High Leg) Phase Purple.

Information Note: Partial Remodel of an Existing Building – i.e. Replace Main Electrical Service where “C” Phase is Purple, & Re-Connect Existing Panels.

(5) 277/480 Volt 4-Wire 3-Phase Wye Systems – “A” Phase Brown, “B” Phase Orange, “C” Phase Yellow.

(6) Ungrounded conductors for other voltages shall be identified by different color coding, marking tape, tagging, or other approved means.

(7) Branch Circuit Conductors for switch legs may be of a different color than the Ungrounded Circuit Conductor when suitably identified at pull boxes, junction boxes and outlet boxes with marking tape, tagging or other equally effective means.

Exception No 1: In Multi-Family Dwelling Unit Buildings supplied by 120/208 Volt 4-Wire 3-Phase Systems, within Dwelling Units supplied by 120/208 Volt 3-Wire Single Phase Systems, Ungrounded Branch Circuit Conductor shall be permitted to be “A” Phase Black, “B” Phase Red.

 

[roger]

I guess nobody does any isolated power systems in hospitals.

 

[hillbilly1]

X

I guess nobody does any isolated power systems in hospitals.

As you already know, that is one of the other situations that code does require certain colors!

 

[mwclarke]

There is an old Walmart in Covington Georgia, that everything is Black Red Blue, 120,208,277 and 480. For some reason that company could not complete that job! They had cases of 1/2” chase nipples for the floresent strip lights that were end to end. LOL!

which one the current is the thrid store there, current mayfield Ace was the first then on teh other side of 142 then current near Highway.

 

[hillbilly1]

which one the current is the thrid store there, current mayfield Ace was the first then on teh other side of 142 then current near Highway.

It’s the real old one, it was built back in the 80’s. It’s something else now. Can’t remember what road it was on, but back towards Conyers, not far off the interstate. South side of the interstate.

 

[tortuga]

Today I mentioned this discussion to a co-worker who reminded me of a data center built in 2012 that uses 416Y/240 with IEC color codes by 'special permission' 90.4 :


Again use a quality multi meter and understand what your working on.
While standards are great and all, relying on color codes is a fools errand.

 

[Carultch]

Today I mentioned this discussion to a co-worker who reminded me of a data center built in 2012 that uses 416Y/240 with IEC color codes by 'special permission' 90.4 :
View attachment 2567546

Again use a quality multi meter and understand what your working on.
While standards are great and all, relying on color codes is a fools errand.

The older UK color code harmonized with our color codes a lot better. They had Red/Yellow/Blue with a black neutral. Simply swap the black neutral for a gray one, and it would be a legal color code to use in the USA.

 

[augie47]

Their code amendments are here:

https://www.murfreesborotn.gov/DocumentCenter/View/8974/2018-Code-Ordinance

Scroll down to about page 14

Chattanooga has a "policy memo", they refer to it as their "90.4 list". The "orange" requirement is there.

 

[hillbilly1]

Chattanooga has a "policy memo", they refer to it as their "90.4 list". The "orange" requirement is there.

That post I did on another thread about the 208 volt gear on 480 was outside Chattanooga. It was a flooring store over near the mall. I know that installing contractor must have slipped that one in on the inspector!

 

[Carultch]

Grey is already designated as a color for the grounded conductor (neutral). Often used to denote the neutral in a 277/480Y circuit, when white is used to denote the neutral in a 120/208Y circuit.

I've also used grey to denote the GFCI-protected neutral of a circuit, to keep me from getting confused and crossing neutrals.

SceneryDriver

In the example I was discussing, gray would be for the neutral of a 240/480V single phase circuit, while white would be for a much more common 120/240V single phase. Not sure how often that would come up in practice, but gray would be my choice for the neutral of the higher voltage systems.

 

[tortuga]

Yeah that's what I would do also.
There was a time not long ago Gray could also be used as a (hot) ungrounded conductor. A gray neutral was supposed to be light gray or natural gray.

I think the silly part of 210.5(C) is by the letter of the code if you run a 2 wire single phase circuit with say MC out of a panel your supposed to phase tape at every splice or termination.

I have seen MC that was just Red/ White, Blue / White, Brown/Gray etc.
I suppose one could get around that in the 210.5(C)(1)(b) by just having a statement covering that.

Speaking of purple and MC can you even get Brown /Purple /Yellow MC ?

 

[ggunn]

So looking at the pole pot which bushing is red and which is black?

Yes.

 

[ggunn]

Seems really bizarre for an AHJ to enforce color codes throughout a jurisdiction.
So in Austin what do you color code a 240/480 single phase?

I have never encountered such an animal; is it real? 480/277V three phase in Austin is brown yellow purple with a "natural gray" (whatever that means) neutral.

 

[augie47]

Old folks are good for something:............................
Back before the thermoplastic insulation when insulations were RHW, RHH, etc/ the manufacturer could not produce a true "white" with those insulations. A "natural grey" was as close as they could come so the Code included "natural grey" with white since that was what was available.

 

[masterinbama]

Old folks are good for something:............................
Back before the thermoplastic insulation when insulations were RHW, RHH, etc/ the manufacturer could not produce a true "white" with those insulations. A "natural grey" was as close as they could come so the Code included "natural grey" with white since that was what was available.

pulled some in my day.

I remember using powdered soap flakes and crushed ice for pulling lube.

 

[Tulsa Electrician]

I have never encountered such an animal; is it real? 480/277V three phase in Austin is brown yellow purple with a "natural gray" (whatever that means) neutral.

Can be a big item if you have a smart AHJ and no local amendment.

I always ask.

 

[douglasbrown78]

At a facility here in Texas they use Brown, Purple, Yellow for 480v WYE, Brown, Orange, Yellow for 480v DELTA, Black, Red, Blue for 120/240v and RED TAPED 6" ORANGE for high leg. White only for 120/240v neutral and gray for 277v neutral. Green for ground and Green with yellow strip for dedicated ground.

 

[ggunn]

...Black, Red, Blue for 120/240v...

I'm pretty sure that is for 208/120V. What you wrote would have the neutral on what? Blue? Not likely.