Circuit Neutrals on Eqpt Ground Bar

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lb9452 said:
If you need the space, you could run a neutral matching the largest neutral on the ground bar to the neutral bar, giving you a copper conductor from ground bar to neutral bar. This should satisfy anyone but the inspector who only knows how to read the book.
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If there are several neutrals on the EGC bus isn't it possible that the the neutral current could be additive and exceed the ampacity of the largest neutral?
 
lb9452 said:
If you need the space, you could run a neutral matching the largest neutral on the ground bar to the neutral bar, giving you a copper conductor from ground bar to neutral bar. This should satisfy anyone but the inspector who only knows how to read the book


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Not necessarily. I see everyone one of those branch circuits being feed from L2. The ‘electrician’ used L2 for the same reason he put the neutrals on that bar. He didn’t know what he was doing.
 
infinity said:
If there are several neutrals on the EGC bus isn't it possible that the the neutral current could be additive and exceed the ampacity of the largest neutral?
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Yes, but in defense of that practice, you are paralleled in with the panel housing, so that would be split according to resistance which would be negligible. Best defense I can come up with.


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lb9452 said:
If you need the space, you could run a neutral matching the largest neutral on the ground bar to the neutral bar, giving you a copper conductor from ground bar to neutral bar. This should satisfy anyone but the inspector who only knows how to read the book


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No, that could lead to that neutral jumper being severely overloaded as infinity alluded to.
Per my post #17 this is the only compliant and safe way to do it. Been tis way in the NEC forever.
 
lb9452 said:
Yes, but in defense of that practice, you are paralleled in with the panel housing, so that would be split according to resistance which would be negligible. Best defense I can come up with.


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An equipment grounding path is not allowed to carry normal current. Never has been. It is only designed and intended to clear a fault.
 
lb9452 said:
If you need the space, you could run a neutral matching the largest neutral on the ground bar to the neutral bar, giving you a copper conductor from ground bar to neutral bar. This should satisfy anyone but the inspector who only knows how to read the book


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"Code is code. Its ok for someone else but not if it costs us time snd money"
Mike Holt
 
lb9452 said:
You’re correct. They are identical, so it makes no practical difference. There are tens of thousands of homes done with romex where the neutrals and grounds are landed together because there weren’t enough places to separate them. Safe. No violation.


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So much wrong here

1st just because they are bonded together does NOT mean they are the same.

2nd it is called a neutral bar and grounding bar for a reason

3rd electricity will always go back to it source, meaning the transformer, so if your neutral conductor’s is tied to your grounding bar you are sending power ( amps) though the casing of the panel, not so if you connect the neutral conductor to the neutral bar.

4th just because it was ok at one time does not mean it is right or safe, we do learn things over time to make things better and safer

5th you sir are the reason there is a NEC codes.


“ shoot low boys their riding shetland ponies”
 
In a panel that contains the service disconnect, the neutral bar is bonded to the enclosure. Neutrals and EGCs can be connected to this bar. If a separate bar is added to accommodate additional neutrals and EGCs then this bar must be connected to the service neutral via a conductor and not solely through the metal enclosure. However, if the separate bar only contains EGCs, then I believe the enclosure will serve to bond these EGCs.
 
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