CL2 cable for Wet Locations

nhee2

Senior Member
Location
NH
2014 NEC, 725.3(L) says that for wet locations, cables need to comply with 300.5(B), which says the cable needs to comply with 310.10(C), which says the cable must be listed for use in wet locations (or moisture impervious metal shielded).

Is anyone aware of a devicenet cable listed for use in wet locations? Application called for Belden 3084A, but will be installed outdoor in UG conduit. I don't see any listing for wet location with the Belden cable.

Or am I misreading the requirement.

Also note 725.3(L) is new to 2014, this requirement did not appear in 2011.

Thanks.
 

petersonra

Senior Member
Location
Northern illinois
Occupation
engineer
2014 NEC, 725.3(L) says that for wet locations, cables need to comply with 300.5(B), which says the cable needs to comply with 310.10(C), which says the cable must be listed for use in wet locations (or moisture impervious metal shielded).

Is anyone aware of a devicenet cable listed for use in wet locations? Application called for Belden 3084A, but will be installed outdoor in UG conduit. I don't see any listing for wet location with the Belden cable.

Or am I misreading the requirement.

Also note 725.3(L) is new to 2014, this requirement did not appear in 2011.

Thanks.
Are you required to meet the 2014 NEC?
 

mwm1752

Senior Member
Location
Aspen, Colo
725.130 Wiring Methods and Materials on Load Side of the Class 2 or Class 3 Power Source
(B) Class 2 and Class 3 Wiring Methods. Conductors on the load side of the power source shall be insulated at not less than the requirements of 725.179 and shall be installed in accordance with 725.133 and 725.154.
Exception No. 2: Other wiring methods and materials installed in accordance with the requirements of 725.3 shall be permitted to extend or replace the conductors and cables described in 725.179 and permitted by 725.130(B).

I believe exception 2# is a path for the use of cables/conductors that have a wet location rating without a specific class 2 or 3 marking -- UF, THHW, XHHW ect.,

NM able to be used for a class 2# circuit inside a residential.
 

petersonra

Senior Member
Location
Northern illinois
Occupation
engineer
725.130 Wiring Methods and Materials on Load Side of the Class 2 or Class 3 Power Source
(B) Class 2 and Class 3 Wiring Methods. Conductors on the load side of the power source shall be insulated at not less than the requirements of 725.179 and shall be installed in accordance with 725.133 and 725.154.
Exception No. 2: Other wiring methods and materials installed in accordance with the requirements of 725.3 shall be permitted to extend or replace the conductors and cables described in 725.179 and permitted by 725.130(B).

I believe exception 2# is a path for the use of cables/conductors that have a wet location rating without a specific class 2 or 3 marking -- UF, THHW, XHHW ect.,

NM able to be used for a class 2# circuit inside a residential.
You can't use GP conductors though for Devicenet as it would not work, even if it meets code.
 

nhee2

Senior Member
Location
NH
You can't use GP conductors though for Devicenet as it would not work, even if it meets code.
Right.

I wonder what was the reason for revising this section in the 2014 NEC. My experience has been if Belden does not make it then it probably doesn't exist, and if it doesn't exist then I am probably reading the code wrong. But it looks to me like my UG DeviceNet connection requires listing for wet locations.
 

nhee2

Senior Member
Location
NH
If UG means underground, wouldn't that imply wet location?
Yes. But I have not found a wet location DeviceNet cable, which was what prompted my post. It looks like a listed wet location cable was not required for CL2 prior to 2014 NEC
 

petersonra

Senior Member
Location
Northern illinois
Occupation
engineer
I sent an email to belden about this.

here is their reply.

Any cable that is labeled as PLTC or TC is suitable for wet locations. Not all Devicenet are labeled as such, especially the smaller gauges. Let me know if you have further question
s.
 

nhee2

Senior Member
Location
NH
I sent an email to belden about this.

here is their reply.

s.
Interesting, I sent a similar question through their website and got a promise of an answer but no answer.

Their devicenet cables don't appear to be PLTC. But maybe there is a PLTC cable that meets the requirements.

Thanks for forwarding.
 

tom baker

First Chief Moderator
Staff member
Allen Bradly has a publication called "On Machine Connectivity". go to their literature library and do a search for it. It should have device net cable. I can check at work tomorrow. I used to buy my micro connectors from brad harris but the availability was "$100 minimum order" but no minimums with AB and great availability. These are the European din connectors that are common on mfg machines
 

Cow

Senior Member
Location
Eastern Oregon
Interesting, I sent a similar question through their website and got a promise of an answer but no answer.

Their devicenet cables don't appear to be PLTC. But maybe there is a PLTC cable that meets the requirements.

Thanks for forwarding.
The Belden 3084A you mentioned in your first post is "TC" though.

http://www.belden.com/techdatas/metric/3084A.pdf

If Petersonra's email response is correct, then this would be a wet location cable.
 

Cow

Senior Member
Location
Eastern Oregon
Everywhere it mentions "TC-tinned copper", no?

Just to satisfy my own curiosity, I also looked up Belden 8760, since we've ran miles of it in outside underground conduits for 4-20ma devices. It also says "TC".
 

nhee2

Senior Member
Location
NH
Everywhere it mentions "TC-tinned copper", no?

Just to satisfy my own curiosity, I also looked up Belden 8760, since we've ran miles of it in outside underground conduits for 4-20ma devices. It also says "TC".
I am assuming TC means tray cable, which is listed for wet locations. 3084A is type CM/CL2, which is not. Belden 8760 is also CM, which is not listed wet location, although I know it is installed for 4-20 loops run outdoors, underground, in many installations. Although this would not meet 2014 article 725 requirements.
 

Cow

Senior Member
Location
Eastern Oregon
Well you got me then. I guess I'd have to call or email Belden to know for sure at this point. I saw the "sunlight resistant" outer jacket in both our cables descriptions and just leaned towards it confirming it was indeed a wet location cable.

EDIT: To answer your original question, when I have a specific cable I need I pass the details along to my supply house. Even if it's not something they stock, they contact their wire distributor who sends back a cut sheet of what they got. But, you're right, I have bought twisted shielded tray cable before just for the 600v rating, which also includes a direct burial rating. So it may take tray cable just to get that wet location rating you want.
 
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