closet clearance

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keenalu1

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if i put an energy eff. 13 w flourecent bulb in a luminare which is normally an incandecent 60w which article clearance supercedes 6" or 12" (ceiling mounted
 
No article supercedes. It still requires 12" clearance because it's still an incandescent luminaire because the fluor. bulb could be removed and replaced with an incandescent.
 
I will fourth that. :D

I have had a couple of contractors try to use that same argument, when then have installed a luminaire too close to the shelf.

Chris
 
But it is not a violation if a flor.stays in it.How many times do we say an inspector cant cite us on a WHAT IF ?That incandesant has a globe over it,what if it gets removed.It says 60 watt max,what if they put in a 100.
No i wouldnt try to get away with this.The potential is too great for misuse .But i do question if its a violation just because a wrong bulb could be put in.
 
Gotta go with Jim on this one the what if,might be done argument is a boat with a huge hole in it.The code is specific incandesant as oposed to fourescent not what might be or can be installed.A 75 W luminare is the max but do we say you can`t install a fixture because JOE homeowner might install a 100 watt bulb :roll: fuse stats stopped the practice of over fusing but luminares are not restricted and all an inspector can inspect is what is installed and the last time I checked open bulb flourescents are allowed and unless sombody gets a change initiated for the next cycle a CF bulb only needs 6 ins and not 12.
 
410.8(B)(1) A surface-mounted or recessed incandescent luminaire (fixture) with a completely enclosed lamp.

If the luminaire is a listed incandescent luminaire, and I install a florescent bulb in the can, does it change the fact that it is a incandescent luminaire?

The way I read this section it talks about the luminaire not the bulb.

I am in total agreement with the statement that we should not inspect for what-ifs. That was not the reason that I would call this a violation.

Chris
 
Chris with a CP it isn`t an incandescent bulb anymore The code was written before the intervention of screw based flourescents and I think it just filtered through.Now if the code says 12 in. for a screw based luminare then that is a horse of another color .All it says is flourescent or incandescent. 6 in and 12 respectivally
 
allenwayne,

I will respectfully have to disagree.

410.8(B) Luminaire (Fixture) Types Permitted. Listed luminaires (fixtures) of the following types shall be permitted to be installed in a closet:

(1) A surface-mounted or recessed incandescent luminaire (fixture) with a completely enclosed lamp.

(2) A surface-mounted or recessed fluorescent luminaire (fixture)

So if the fixture, um excuse me luminaire, is a listed incandescent luminaire, then regardless of the bulb, it is a listed incandescent fixture and must comply with 410.8(D)(1) and be 12 inches away from the nearest point of storage.

Chris
 
The requirement is not about the lamp. It is about the type of luminaire. If the luminaire is incandescent listed, it is an incandescent regardless of the lamp installed.

I believe there have been proposals to permitt the use of flourescent lamps in incandescent luminaires and be able to follow flourescent luminaire requirements... they were rejected.
 
Jim, Allen, look inside the next can you hang, and inside the next fixture you hang. You will see a tag inside from the UL (all the ones I saw on fixtures today were a hologram sticker) that states "Incandescent Luminaire."

It's an incandescent luminaire, regardless of the lamp installed. ;)
 
georgestolz said:
Jim, Allen, look inside the next can you hang, and inside the next fixture you hang. You will see a tag inside from the UL (all the ones I saw on fixtures today were a hologram sticker) that states "Incandescent Luminaire."

It's an incandescent luminaire, regardless of the lamp installed. ;)
Click to expand...

Ok i can live with that.But just what fixture are we to buy to use that flor. bulb ? Cant help the fact that they allowed this bulb to fit the same socket.How about a smart mfg. that gets a keyless to be approved for using a flor. bulb ? How could they refuse to allow it when they made it to fit and it runs cooler.We got to get over this WHAT IF idea.I do agree there is a danger but the mr homeowner can replace that afci 15 amp breaker with a 30 amp too.Put a sticker on it,that always works.LOL
 
Jim
There are plenty of flourescent type luminaire available.
We do not need to get over the "what if" thing, you need to deal with the code requirement(s). The flourescent luminaire may be more expensive, so then you will need to make a decision... more mony/more room.
 
Hey Pierre, don't think the wrong thing. Despite the fact you posted the exact same thing that I posted before I did, I was looking forward to posting it all day. All day long those hologram stickers were taunting me until I could post. :D
 
So here i sit with that screw in flor. bulb but i must use it as an incandecent.I know nec tries to cover everything but this is flat out stupid.Yes i agree its how its written.We are scared to death that the flor. will be replaced by an incandecnt but do nothing to stop them from using a 100 and leave the globe off.About time we wake up.
 
Jim
There was a death here around 3 weeks ago, because the people put an incandescent lamp in a fixture and then loaded the closet.. the kid was 18 years old. Just to say this is still happening today.


George
I had a computer guy here trying to figure out what is "bugging" my computer. He did a lot of work and was doing a lot of head scratching. He concluded that some guy on the web was hacking my computer and getting my posts as I was typing them. Now I know it was you. :lol: :lol:
 
Pierre C Belarge said:
Jim
There was a death here around 3 weeks ago, because the people put an incandescent lamp in a fixture and then loaded the closet.. the kid was 18 years old. Just to say this is still happening today.


George
I had a computer guy here trying to figure out what is "bugging" my computer. He did a lot of work and was doing a lot of head scratching. He concluded that some guy on the web was hacking my computer and getting my posts as I was typing them. Now I know it was you. :lol: :lol:
Click to expand...

Would like to see the details on that case.What kinf of fixture and how close.Many old houses used keyless.Like i said earlier i would never actually install a light where this could happen but the code needs written better.

Yes i could hack your computer.Many computers are easily hacked and if its on a wireless router you make it easy :) :) :) But i am a nice guy that would never do that.
 
Jim W in Tampa said:
.Like i said earlier i would never actually install a light where this could happen but the code needs written better..
Click to expand...

Jim WTF?

How much clearer can it be about this issue?

Incandescent luminaires have one set of rules.

Fluorescent luminaires have another set of rules.

It is the FIXTURE LISTING not the lamp installed in it that makes the difference.

The electrician installs the FIXTURE so there is no what ifs about the homeowner at the time of inspection.
 
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