Conduit on fence?

[4-20mA]

This comment isn't directed at you but the picture is a good backdrop. Fences aren't put there for people to climb over, so that shouldn't be a code issue, but as many other considerations, a customer issue. If the posters who are so adamant that it is beneath their quality standards, the they shouldn't install it that way. For the rest of us, it is up to the customer, and the AHJ (to determine the "where subject to damage" clause. We can argue all day long but the AHJ has all the power in this situation. As others have pointed out, the fence construction could have a lot to do with whether it passes AHJ muster. I can think of chain link fences and installations (like the one in this picture) that I would approve and many that I would shoot down.

Careful, next thing you'll know is you're letting the AHJ make up rules.

 

[mtnelect]

Emt on chain link fence probably invisible to layman

What if the fence became electrified from some fault issue like street lighting poles have been in the past ?

That would be a shocker !

 

[jap]

What if the fence became electrified from some fault issue like street lighting poles have been in the past ?

That would be a shocker !

We're professionals here.

Or at least I'd like to think so.

If you have a light pole or a fence that remains energized due to your lack of understanding the difference between grounding and bonding you shouldn't be in this profession.

JAP>

 

[jap]

Any conductive material associated with electrical can become accidently energized.

There's no way around it.

We put ground fault return paths in place to take care of that issue to the best of our ability, but, unforeseen accidents still happen.

The question on this post is can conduit be run on a chain link fence and the answer is "yes" as long as it meets the rules of the code and the inspector agrees that the fence is stable enough to support the run.

The inspector also has the authority to allow or deny the install on a case by case basis.

That's what we have inspections for.

JAP>

 

[petersonra]

The inspector also has the authority to allow or deny the install on a case by case basis.

Not true. The inspector can only fail you if you do not meet code (or whatever code changes have been made by the local AHJ). He is not authorized to make up things on his own, nor is he allowed to allow you a free pass on stuff that does not meet code.

Now, sometimes both happen, but he has no such authority.

 

[jap]

Not true. The inspector can only fail you if you do not meet code (or whatever code changes have been made by the local AHJ). He is not authorized to make up things on his own, nor is he allowed to allow you a free pass on stuff that does not meet code.

Now, sometimes both happen, but he has no such authority.

They kind of go hand in hand don't they?

If a pipe run was properly fastened to a fence that has its supports rotted off at the ground making it too flimsy for support, wouldn't he have the authority to fail it?

JAP>

 

[jap]

On the other hand that same run mounted on a sturdy fence with good supports could pass....

The code doesnt indicate the level of support needed.

That would be a judgement call by the inspector would it not?


JAP>

 

[petersonra]

They kind of go hand in hand don't they?

If a pipe run was properly fastened to a fence that has its supports rotted off at the ground making it too flimsy for support, wouldn't he have the authority to fail it?

JAP>

I don't know. Would depend a lot on what basis he was trying to fail it. What objective criteria would be used in such a case?

 

[jap]

I don't know. Would depend a lot on what basis he was trying to fail it. What objective criteria would be used in such a case?

I guess for a floppy fence he could ask,,,, " Excuse me,,,, is that fence supporting the conduit, or, is the conduit supporting the fence??",,
then we'd sit there and look at each other aimlessly for a while,,, because I know electrical conduit cannot support non-electrical equipment.,,,




JAP>

 

[petersonra]

It seems unlikely that a chain link fence would have rotted posts. It would fall over and longer be a fence. Just some junk laying on the ground.

 

[retirede]

It seems unlikely that a chain link fence would have rotted posts. It would fall over and longer be a fence. Just some junk laying on the ground.

We had a schoolyard with chain link fence posts rusting badly where they emerged from the concrete. About half of them were broken off, but between the ones not fully broken and the top rail, the fence still stood fairly well.

If someone were dumb enough to run new conduit on this fence, it should fail an inspection.

 

[petersonra]

We had a schoolyard with chain link fence posts rusting badly where they emerged from the concrete. About half of them were broken off, but between the ones not fully broken and the top rail, the fence still stood fairly well.

If someone were dumb enough to run new conduit on this fence, it should fail an inspection.

on what objective code based reasoning would it fail? how would this be any different than hanging it from rods that swing back and forth?

 

[jap]

on what objective code based reasoning would it fail? how would this be any different than hanging it from rods that swing back and forth?

Good point.

All the more reasoning why conduit is allowed to be run on chain link fences, and, I'd say the majority of us know when not to do so even if we could.

JAP>

 

[retirede]

on what objective code based reasoning would it fail? how would this be any different than hanging it from rods that swing back and forth?

The fence will either be removed or fall over within a year. In the case I mentioned, it was removed.

Rods that swing have a limited range of movement. This fence will likely destroy the raceway when it falls.

We’re playing “what if” at this point. I personally think a structurally sound chain link fence is fine as a raceway support.

 

[mtnelect]

This is an example of what type of fault could happen. This is one post and not a Chain Llink fence at whatever distance of exposure.

 

[petersonra]

This is an example of what type of fault could happen. This is one post and not a Chain Llink fence at whatever distance of exposure.

the example showed a code violation that could result in a shock. not merely mounting conduit to a fence.

 

[Buck Parrish]

How's about a meter on a fence. I've done that before, too. see here

 

[Dsg319]

This is an example of what type of fault could happen. This is one post and not a Chain Llink fence at whatever distance of exposure.

None of this would be a worry if the conduit and fence is properly bonded to the EGC.

 

[Strathead]

For sure.
I would make my own quality/longevity assessment on a case-by-case basis.

That's what I was getting at when I started with "it might depend...." and should have been more clear there. The photo was meant to be an example of how you "might not" want to do it.

I wouldn't have had a problem with doing it the way it is in the picture.

 

[jap]

None of this would be a worry if the conduit and fence is properly bonded to the EGC.

I beg to differ.

Your response was in reference to the example mtnelec posted, which was an example of improper wiring causing neutral current to flow on normally non current carrying parts of an electrical system from the neutral conductor being attached to the metal pole.

That's different than a fault.

No amount of grounding or bonding would clear that neutral return current flow beacause its not a short, it's simply a parallel return path.

Nothing short of a GFI protected circuit to the pole light that is.

If we wanted to exaggerate the issue of a fence becoming energized due to an actual fault, without proper bonding and grounding throughout the system,we could " electrify" a metal building of any size and never clear the fault.

Jap>