Connection to the Concrete Encased Electrode

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jwelectric said:
Yes I did say that the GEC to the rods was to be sized according to 250.66(B) which would be a #4 going to the rods and then on the the tail left for the CEE where a split bolt could be used.

Is this correct?
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As per 250.70 the connection to the CEE would have to be listed as such. If you're talking about a connection to a bonding jumper "tail", I would think this connection would have to be an exothermic weld, listed pressure connector (split bolt?), listed lugs, or listed clamps. I've seen split bolts permitted on GEC's and bonding jumpers by local inspectors but always thought more toward the irreversible connection method. :)
 
wbalsam1 said:
When daisy-chaining bonding jumpers one has to be careful. Rods are permitted to have #6 cu yet CEE requires #4 cu. This #4 cu would not be permitted to reduce to #6. 250.64(F)
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Well that would depend on the size of the service entrance conductors. For a typical 150 amp service the GEC is only required to be #6 in the first place so you could have a #6 to the rods and the rebar.
 
A/A Fuel GTX said:
Chris....on side note, would you consider the GEC connection to the main bonding jumper located in the section of a service that is sealed by the POCO as accessible? My AHJ says "no". I say "yes" because it is accessible without damaging anything but a couple of POCO seals.
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I have always considered this type of install as accessible. I know some POCO's will not allow this connection to be made in their meter section though.

Chris
 
raider1 said:
I have always considered this type of install as accessible. I know some POCO's will not allow this connection to be made in their meter section though.

Chris
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Agreed....and my POCO won't allow this connection in a standard meter socket as in a 200 or 320A unit but when a service with multiple meters is involved and the section for the lateral or service entrance conductors to be terminated in is huge, they don't have a problem. I think that is the difference when space is not at a premium.
 
iwire said:
There is a major difference, the NEC specifically tells us that section is part of the electrode.
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I know you'll be surprised to hear me say this ( :D ), but I disagree. The NEC specifically tells us the entire water pipe is part of the electrode, and we've been restricted to using no farther than the first five feet inside the structure (and outside the dirt) since 1993.

Pierre's post in this thread showed that prior to 1993, absolutely no mention of the piping outside of dirt and inside a structure was made in regards to water pipe electrodes, yet it was commonly connected to outside of the area described as the earthing portion of the electrode.

Today's language does not permit us to connect to electrodes outside of the portions of the electrode that do the work, it forbids us from making a connection past 5' from where the water pipe does it's work. People see the prohibition and conclude from the prohibition that it's giving us permission to connect within 5'.

I say we can connect to a water pipe between zero and five feet because the NEC doesn't say that we can't.

Similarly, I believe we can connect to a CEE stubbed out of the foundation because the NEC doesn't say that we can't.

And I can't believe I forgot to submit a proposal on this. :mad:

Anyway, that's my opinion, for better or worse. :)
 
Our local POCO (EMC) requires the GEC to be run thru the meter base AND up the mast out the weatherhead connecting at both locations. But Georgia power does not want it anywhere near their equipment. They even balk if you have bond bushings on their side of the equipment!
 
hillbilly1 said:
Our local POCO (EMC) requires the GEC to be run thru the meter base AND up the mast out the weatherhead connecting at both locations. But Georgia power does not want it anywhere near their equipment. They even balk if you have bond bushings on their side of the equipment!
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Why would they want a GEC in parallel with the neutral?
 
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