Copper in water

kwired said:
Have no idea if they tested PH levels. Pretty certain they tested chlorine levels but that may been about all the health dept cared about.
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For chlorine to work properly the PH and total alkalinity have to be right also. My nieces' husband works for the health department and I bought this house and pool last year, I asked him to test the water when I opened the pool this spring. Then I got the same drop type test kit (less some tests that I would never use). He tests everything applicable to the public pool he's at.

For giggles, I tested the PH of the tap water here and it was above 9 (the test only goes that high). 9 is alkaline. I guess I should keep that in mind when adding water to the pool that should be between 7.5-7.8.

Years ago in my old house I always had green stains from the water. Then they switched sources from one aqueduct that served NYC to another. (We were entitled to take water from those aqueducts since they went through our town.) Problem went away.

kwired said:
Blue residue in toilet bowl? what they use to clean it with?
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An acid type shower, toilet and urinal cleaner. Contains hydrochloric acid. Takes it right off. Use gloves.

-Hal
 
Elect117 said:
Everyone in LA is putting in water filtration systems for all water entering the home. In some areas, filters need to be replaced often. It used to just be for at the sink or refrigerator, but now the hot new thing is putting it at the water meter for all water entering. Softens the supplied water from limestone and is supposed to just be better for your skin and hair. I couldn't tell you if it helps. I don't own one.

What is the company they are using to do the testing and what part of LA? Did they get the test results or did the company offer fixes? They can call LADWP and ask them to test the water themselves.

www.ladwp.com

Water System

LADWP provides safe, reliable and high-quality water to the residents, businesses and visitors of the second largest city in America.
www.ladwp.com www.ladwp.com

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Thanks for this. 2 of the jobs are in Beverly Hills. I’m told they tested the water out at the meter and it’s fine there but inside the home coming out of the shower and bath sinks is where the high levels of copper are showing.
We lifted the cold water ground and then tested between it and the water pipe for DC current and it’s all clear. Not sure where else to go with it on our end.
The unfortunate thing is the clients have now got it in their heads that our electrical is poisoning them!
I exaggerate but you get the picture.
 
Scoop789 said:
I’m told they tested the water out at the meter and it’s fine there but inside the home coming out of the shower and bath sinks is where the high levels of copper are showing.
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Yeah. The acidic water is leaching the copper out of the copper plumbing. That copper is dissolved into the water and eventually it will cause the copper plumbing to become thinner and thinner then pinhole and leak. Test the water coming into the house for Ph, not copper. Below 6.0 is considered corrosive to copper plumbing.

-Hal
 
hbiss said:
Yeah. The acidic water is leaching the copper out of the copper plumbing. That copper is dissolved into the water and eventually it will cause the copper plumbing to become thinner and thinner than pinhole and leak. Test the water coming into the house for Ph, not copper. Below 6.0 is considered corrosive to copper plumbing.

-Hal
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Yes.
And in the case of a swimming pool, the makeup/fill water introduces copper into the pool as a solid as it has fallen out of solution. It then hangs to everything including hair. And of course, all pool owners balance their water:p. Many times, the pool water is unbalanced, and the water is acidic exacerbating the current condition.
It's best to test water coming into a home. I do it for pool application. I need to know my source water in order to treat properly.
 
Scoop789 said:
The unfortunate thing is the clients have now got it in their heads that our electrical is poisoning them!
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It's always the electricians fault, even when it involves plumbing.
Maybe because I can hire an electronian for much less, per hour, than I can a plumber?
 
jim dungar said:
It's always the electricians fault, even when it involves plumbing.
Maybe because I can hire an electronian for much less, per hour, than I can a plumber?
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Yet the plumber is likely clueless on water chemistry issues. Newer plumbers only know Pex or how to adapt it to other piping and not much more when it comes to such quirks of other piping.
 
I have the definitive report on water corrosion and grounding from the American water works association. AC grounding to water pipes does not cause corrosion. DC currents do.To the OP, ask you water company or find on line for its consumer confidence report. Look for source water treatment and corrosion control
 
hbiss said:
So, I'm not crazy after all when I thought to do that.

-Hal
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Not at all. Knowing the water source gives lots of information on how to properly treat not just on the initial fill. but going forward.
A build in Brooklyn I did about 15 years ago I tested water before filling. Surprisingly ii was acidic.
 
I have a well that I super shock when I smell sulfur. Not often.
I use the same chlorine that is used in pools. Dissolve in water bucket and pour it down the well head.
Wait a day and flush it out. Not uncommon.
 
Scoop789 said:
I’ve been in business for 23 years and never heard of electrical current causing dangerous levels of copper in a homes water.
Now in the space of a few months we’ve had 3 clients complain that after having some water control company measure their water in their homes that the recommendation is to check for current leaking on to the pipes.
I’m going to to this but has anyone heard of this before?
One client is complaining that her hair is turning green and another is complaining about blue residue in the toilet bowls.
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Electricity while taking the shortest ( lowest resistance ) flow it also at least with the grounded conductor ( ya dumb confusing word for hundred year term Nuetral ) on the service back to the utility company transformer. Several times I have measured up to 0.25 amps on a copper water service & 0.1 amps on steel gas pipe even with the house circuit breaker off & meter pulled while performing service upgrades. A plant in South Jersey had a 3" copper water line running entire length of a dry basement that had at least 6 rubber patches over pin holes leaks on that ten year old copper lines. Of course the water department stated their was nothing wrong with their water. Place had pre cut rubber patches, pieces of sheet metal to go over the rubber and a bunch of 3" hose clamps for pin hole leaks. Over ten years ago I had a very fine pin hole leak in a copper line over our clothes dryer. Maybe once every few minutes a very fine mist came out. Plumber friend told me to purchase a 3 /4" slip coupling and instal it at leak. For some reason pin hole leak sealed itself. Left a plastic container under leak for a year and never found any water.
 
DooWop said:
I have a well that I super shock when I smell sulfur. Not often.
I use the same chlorine that is used in pools. Dissolve in water bucket and pour it down the well head.
Wait a day and flush it out. Not uncommon.
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I have well water and have a sulfur problem too. I installed a water purifier and water softener (Apec Water Systems)
No smell. It's been on about10 years.
 
coming around to this thread again as two different water testing companies are saying the water coming in is ok and that the high copper content is being caused from something in the home and they're leaning towards electrolysis from the electrical system.
I know other members here have mentioned that it's DC current that causes electrolysis so with that said we do have a lot of Low voltage wiring all over the home that feeds low voltage 24V DC strip lights. We do a pretty good job of strapping these clear of any type of pipes but the home is huge and there was a lot of plumbing after some of that wiring was put in. I'm just throwing different ideas out there but anyone think DC current could be leaking from this wiring to copper piping if they're touching?
 
Probably should let the water run for like 10 or 15 minutes before taking a sample. If there is a high copper level, then it's all on the water department
 
Get the consumer confidence report from the water supplier. See what the pH is and if they do corrosion control, low pH water can erode the protective film on lead and copper (think Flint MI).
 
Scoop789 said:
I know other members here have mentioned that it's DC current that causes electrolysis so with that said we do have a lot of Low voltage wiring all over the home that feeds low voltage 24V DC strip lights. We do a pretty good job of strapping these clear of any type of pipes but the home is huge and there was a lot of plumbing after some of that wiring was put in. I'm just throwing different ideas out there but anyone think DC current could be leaking from this wiring to copper piping if they're touching?
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Do those DC power supplies ground either of the DC outputs (typically the - side)? I would think they float. Hard to determine where DC would be coming from unless it is something like a phone, CATV, or somehow on the grounded conductor.

Ask to see the water test, so you can see what they tested and if pH was included. Or go buy some swimming pool test strips and test the water yourself.

You could isolate the water pipe if it is metal outside in the dirt (PVC or polyethylene coupling).

Do they have solar panels and somehow the DC is getting onto the piping?

Are there any mismatched materials that in the plumbing system that could cause electrolysis? Like stainless steel, nickel, cupro-mickel, bronze, or lead on the copper pipe? Not sure if that would do it or not... Iron and steel aren't a huge problem for corroding copper, but they are the other way around, just like magnesium and zinc give off their metals easily.

Any of those funky magic water conditioner doo-dads that clamp to the water pipe and do who knows what to the pipe or water?
It seems like this should be some of a plumber job to diagnose, and electrician to fix if it turns out to be electrical.
 
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