Death of construction company owner and how to move forward

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That does not make a person a scam artist. A scam artist goes into a business arrangement with the intension of taking advange of someone. They normally take advantage of homeowners by doing a little work and getting a big draw and hitting the road.

It sounds like the GC was planning to at least try to finish the jobs that he had started and collect for them and pay his subs but he died. If a person (GC) runs out of money and just can't pay you that doesn't mean they are a scam artist just they are not good at business.

I had a homeowner stiff me for a few hundred bucks years ago but he was not a scam artist. He offered me a riding lawn mower (new) that I should have taken and sold for whatever. Tuned out he owed everyone money and couldn't pay. You can't get blood from a turnip.

IMO staying in business when one is unable to pay his bills just because one is able to get away with it for a while, is a scam. These guys are not stupid people. They know when they are underwater. But they are so desperate to maintain the facade that they won't do the honorable thing.
 
IMO staying in business when one is unable to pay his bills just because one is able to get away with it for a while, is a scam. These guys are not stupid people. They know when they are underwater. But they are so desperate to maintain the facade that they won't do the honorable thing.

It's the American way. Half the small businessses out there are living off the future. This whole darn country is built on borrrowed money and borrowed time.

Near me is an electrical contractor that is very successful (now) but one of the owners told me that at one time he and the other investors were millions in debt and even had their homes mortgaged to cover business expenses. He said he didn't get a good nights sleep for two years running but they finally made it.

Some people think giving up is the honorable thing and others think it's a lack of guts. Even being in business is not for the faint of heart.
 
Scam artist or incompetent is irrelevant, same actions need to be taken in either case.

Lien laws appear to be different in different states, in Georgia a lien is only good for a year, and then it becomes necessary to sue (or so 2 different lawyers have told me{and charged me for the information}),
 
Doesn't sound much like a scam artist to me, just some poor sod that got in to deep and couldn't figure a way so he started drinking heavily and taking a few pills to mellow out. Happens all the time.
Been there myself, poor money management isn't the same as intentionally taking advantage of others.
 
IMO staying in business when one is unable to pay his bills just because one is able to get away with it for a while, is a scam. These guys are not stupid people. They know when they are underwater. But they are so desperate to maintain the facade that they won't do the honorable thing.
Like I said, been there myself. I did not stay in it to rip people off, I truly thought I could turn things around again.

The biggest problem clients had with me was jobs that did not get completed in timely fashion as we needed more funds from other projects to be able to pay the bills for materials for old jobs, then the newer job eventually got to the same point of low cash when more materials were needed, yet you already got advanced funding from the owner and did not want to ask them for more, especially when you were not getting things done. A very frustrating situation and hard to get out of. At same time supply houses shut down your credit - you had to pay at time of purchase and usually didn't get as good of a price on items as you used to making things even harder.
 
yet you already got advanced funding from the owner and did not want to ask them for more, especially when you were not getting things done.

kwired I can tell that you are not a "scam artist" because I have worked for companies that would do anything to get more money from a customer to include turning in fake progress reports. You would assume a job was about 90% complete when in reality it may only be 50% complete. Many of the companies actually manage to pull it off and are still in business.
 
kwired I can tell that you are not a "scam artist" because I have worked for companies that would do anything to get more money from a customer to include turning in fake progress reports. You would assume a job was about 90% complete when in reality it may only be 50% complete. Many of the companies actually manage to pull it off and are still in business.

IMo that is no different than kiting checks.
 
Like I said, been there myself. I did not stay in it to rip people off, I truly thought I could turn things around again.

The biggest problem clients had with me was jobs that did not get completed in timely fashion as we needed more funds from other projects to be able to pay the bills for materials for old jobs, then the newer job eventually got to the same point of low cash when more materials were needed, yet you already got advanced funding from the owner and did not want to ask them for more, especially when you were not getting things done. A very frustrating situation and hard to get out of. At same time supply houses shut down your credit - you had to pay at time of purchase and usually didn't get as good of a price on items as you used to making things even harder.

I've seen this happen before. It's not so bad as long as you're not stealing too much from Peter to pay Paul and over one or two quarters you're still running a profit. Where it bites you is when you do it to cover a job that has tanked horribly but you need to avoid liquidated damages for example. If it eats the profit for your whole year that's pretty much the end of the line. You can't cover the normal hiccups and it just snowballs.
 
I kind of wonder what happened to Jay. I hope he didn't fall into some legal black hole and will never be seen again.

Maybe the wife had some poison left over and invited him in for milk and cookies.
 
I kind of wonder what happened to Jay. I hope he didn't fall into some legal black hole and will never be seen again.

Maybe the wife had some poison left over and invited him in for milk and cookies.

He is probably busy trying to save his business from his best customer who suddenly became his worst customer.
 
I kind of wonder what happened to Jay. I hope he didn't fall into some legal black hole and will never be seen again.

Maybe the wife had some poison left over and invited him in for milk and cookies.

Holy Arsenic and Old Lace, Batman!
 
Nothing happened to me, :p. They're probably going bankruptcy route, I'm going liens route. Let it all play out. To totally lawyer up will cost me the amount I'm owed, so I took my free advice and we'll see where it takes me.
 
I don't have any actual contracts for any of the work performed. All I have is hundreds of invoices that were paid without incident. Lawyer said that may help, but it would depend on the judge.
 
Nothing happened to me, :p. They're probably going bankruptcy route, I'm going liens route. Let it all play out. To totally lawyer up will cost me the amount I'm owed, so I took my free advice and we'll see where it takes me.

Don't worry about collecting anything, especially if it is only a five figure number or less you are owed, banks and attorneys always get whatever they can and after they take their share nothing is left for those owed lesser amounts.
 
I don't have any actual contracts for any of the work performed. All I have is hundreds of invoices that were paid without incident. Lawyer said that may help, but it would depend on the judge.

A verbal contract is a contract. A contract has four parts, the offer, acceptance, consideration, and legality. My opinion is that I as the contractor make the offer and the customer accepts, but I'm sure there are many equal and opposite opinions about that.

Mentally it might be best to consider it a lost cause and move on without losing any more time, capital, thought process. POM peace of mind.

Two things you can try.

If you feel you're on good terms with them and want to test that, ask them to convert your verbal contract to a written one. Prepare your invoice to settle everything where it is now. That is your demand letter. You may ask them to agree in writing that they accept the invoice and they agree (accept) they owe you the money. In effect they would be writing you a note.

The lien is more powerful, collectionwise. Any property owner going for refi or another draw on their construction loan will have to deal with the bank who does not want to proceed with liens ahead of them. It will mess up the owner's otherwise unrelated project financing and for a small amount it will be far cheaper for them to settle with you rather than try to maneuver around the lien.

Lien it and let them come to you.

A signed acceptance note from the former GC would be in their favor to do as in dispute, your claim for damages would only get bigger as your costs progress upwards.

The other thing is to get paid now in materials and tools. See what they want to part with. If they are any kind on contractor they should have some kind of fleet, trucks, backhoes, compactors, tractors. Going BK and out, may as well be you who gets it.

......

When I was putting in my septic field, house under construction, this guy drives in my driveway on like a Sunday afternoon when I was operating, grading with the machine. From 80 ft away I got a bad vibe off him and immediately wanted him gone and off my driveway.

So I go over and see what he wants, trying to not let on he tripped something that rarely but very accurately gives alarm.

He sees the construction and offers to pour concrete. I thank him and say truely we are pouring everything ourselves. But he lets on as promotion, reference, that he just did the new large garage down the street, which I was aware of.

That week my portable bandsaw disappears from the unsecured new basement opening and I say a silent prayer of thank you that they did not walk in 15 ft farther and take the Sokkia site laser, that I could not afford to replace.

I make the rounds of the local pawn shops looking for my bandsaw. And think, mmm, what criminal recently visited me, I don't have the concrete guys name. I'm gonna get his name and call him, ask for my bandsaw.

So I politely visit the job down the street, at night as it happened, to get the concrete guy's name, see if the customer is happy with the work, and ask if he happened to see the guy toting my bandsaw.

The owner knew who I was and told me his story.

He was building a huge garage to go with the new house. He was part of a group that followed local cart racers around and sold parts for the cars. They raced with Yamaha 600 cc 4 cyl powered carts. garage was for the business.

So it's night and he drives me one house over, from the existing house he's living in to the new construction next door. He positions the truck so the headlights are shooting up into the air and then he says, "there's the slab".

I had no idea what he was talking about but then he explains it. There's this huge pile of topsoil and removed material and the slab the kid poured was up on top of that pile, in pieces, hard to see at night.

The garage was maybe in the range of 4000 sf, way bigger than normal. He tells me what happened. The kid showed up with one or two people short from what he said, and some of the guys were drunk. When he looked at the slab the next day it looked off, wavy, and then he put a string on it and was sliding 2 x 4 pieces tall side up under the string.

So he decided the slab was coming out, stopped the check for $5000, and called the kid and told him to not try cashing it.

Then he says, the kid's mother showed up at his house the next day with a lien on the new house and a lien for the old house he was living in. He was using the old house for financing and that stopped his project.

He consulted a lawyer who told him it would cost more to straighten this out legally than to just pay in full for the bad work. That's what he did.
 
When I was putting in my septic field, house under construction, this guy drives in my driveway on like a Sunday afternoon when I was operating, grading with the machine. From 80 ft away I got a bad vibe off him and immediately wanted him gone and off my driveway.
That week my portable bandsaw disappears from the unsecured new basement opening.....

I make the rounds of the local pawn shops looking for my bandsaw. And think, mmm, what criminal recently visited me, I don't have the concrete guys name. I'm gonna get his name and call him, ask for my bandsaw.

So I politely visit the job down the street, at night as it happened, to get the concrete guy's name, see if the customer is happy with the work, and ask if he happened to see the guy toting my bandsaw.

Probably a pointless question, but did you ever find out what became of the saw?

And thats a shame what happened to your neighbor- he got scammed and that "contractor" and his mother were true pieces of crap.:rant:
And always best to listen to your gut, its usually right.:)
 
Probably a pointless question, but did you ever find out what became of the saw?

And thats a shame what happened to your neighbor- he got scammed and that "contractor" and his mother were true pieces of crap.:rant:
And always best to listen to your gut, its usually right.:)

Nope. I lost a bandsaw twice I believe and just bought another one three days later. Absolutely necessary for work.

While my father's shop was unattended (before he passed but while he was incapacitated), his TE 72 disappeared at the same time a contractor was there repairing the outside stair. I was keeping an eye on it from out of town and I let it known literally saying that if I got the TE 72 back nothing would be said and it would be forgotten, also letting it be known but not saying that if I did not get the drill back, someone would ( ) over it and it would not take me long for that to happen. I got the drill right back.

Unfortunately, I have a blind spot for trusting people at their word who are, well, liars. Hundreds of them. That signal I have only got a few times in my life, but the hit rate is 100%.
 
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Wife called. Says, "We owe you money. We want to have the customers pay you directly."

I don't want to get my hopes up, but this is looking like a favorable solution.
 
Wife called. Says, "We owe you money. We want to have the customers pay you directly."

I don't want to get my hopes up, but this is looking like a favorable solution.
As long as that does not involve the customer double paying for money already collected from the customer but not yet paid to you....
 
Wife called. Says, "We owe you money. We want to have the customers pay you directly."

I don't want to get my hopes up, but this is looking like a favorable solution.

I hope you said thank you. That's honorable of them to make sure the subs are made whole. Glad it worked out. Sorry for the loss of your friend. My condolences.
 
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