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While the SE is not listed for direct burial (underground) it is listed for wet locations. A cable or conductor in an underground raceway is in a wet location. It is not directly buried. Very few wet location single conductors are listed for underground use (directly buried), but they are installed in underground raceways all of the time.
Don
 
don

SE cable is listed for aboveground, USE is listed for underground & direct burial, SE cable underground violates the listing of the cable
 
mpd said:
SE cable is listed for aboveground, USE is listed for underground & direct burial, SE cable underground violates the listing of the cable
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You still have not shown me where I find single conductor THHN RHW etc that is listed for underground use.

Strange how it is very commonly used for underground runs.....in a raceway.

You also did not explain why the 230.30s '4' is needed at all if we can not use any SE in a raceway underground.

The only time we use SE underground it is AL SER installed in PVC raceways there is no issue about the grounded conductor as it is fully insulated.

We do this for feeders for temporary job trailers or temp panels in the buildings.

The reason we do this is that is cost effective as we can come up out of the ground with the PVC and run the SER further without the costs of boxes and terminations.

No one questions it as it is safe, effective and IMO code compliant. 8)
 
This thread is a perfect example of everything I love about this website. Once in a while I run into Alum SER cable run thru pvc underground, and, having heard enough inspectors say it is a code violation, I report it back to owners as being such, and have often recommended a replacement. Now, I have my doubts. As usual, thank you Bob and others for the education I could not get elsewhere.
 
I learned something here as well. 8)

mpd has shown me bare AL conductors can not be used as the grounded conductor underground.

I don't use much AL so it was not something I was aware of.

Even in copper I always end up running an insulated EGC.
 
iwire

230.30 is for service laterals, you would not have an equipment grounding conductor, SER AL that is used from a house to a detached is a feeder, 338 refers you to art 225 part 1 and 396, why would the NEC not also refer us to 300.5 for SE cable when used as a feeder? and you keep asking me abount single conductors, we are talking about a cable assembly that is listed for aboveground, that is being installed underground
 
mpd said:
and you keep asking me abount single conductors, we are talking about a cable assembly that is listed for aboveground, that is being installed underground
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I keep asking because you have not answered.

Where is my permission to run THHN underground if in fact your correct that cables and conductors installed in raceways underground must be listed for underground use?

Why does 300.5(D)(5) only require a wet listing for cables and conductors installed in raceways underground.

300.5(D)(5) Listing. Cables and insulated conductors installed in enclosures or raceways in underground installations shall be listed for use in wet locations.
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Notice it does not require the cable assembly to be listed for underground use.
 
iwire

if that is the case then SE cable should be listed for underground or aboveground, it is not, when installed as a feeder 338 refers you to aboveground code sections why is that? why is 300.5 not included in exterior installations for SE cable, it is for USE cable,
 
Where is it shown that SE-R is rated for wet locations? :?:

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I don't understand how it's legal to put this in a conduit underground any more than putting romex in the same conduit. :?:
 
George, ser is listed for wet locations. It can be run on exterior surfaces (wet locations). It is also sunlight resistant, but not much sunshine inside underground conduits.
 
georgestolz said:
Where is it shown that SE-R is rated for wet locations? :?:
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:shock:

If you can find an inch of any SE that is not suitable for wet locations I will be very surprised.

Could you use it on the exterior if it was not suitable wet locations?
 
iwire said:
If you can find an inch of any SE that is not suitable for wet locations I will be very surprised.

Could you use it on the exterior if it was not suitable wet locations?
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Okay, I just looked a bit closer at the pdf I downloaded yesterday. It didn't say anything about wet locations, so I just now looked at the conductor types. XHHW-2 is okay for wet locations according to Table 310.13.

I've never used it in a wet location (i.e. aboveground outside) so I never really thought about it. :)

So, I'd say it is legal in a raceway underground, as odd as this new information is to me. 8)
 
georgestolz said:
I've never used it in a wet location (i.e. aboveground outside) so I never really thought about it. :)
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George how is that? :?

Are all services in your area underground?

Very different from this area, here both overhead and underground services are equally used.
 
For the most part, they are all underground. On overhead service swaps, generally it is in rigid. I forgot that out east cable gets stapled to the side of the structure. Very rarely ever see that here. :)
 
Can't say I've ever seen SE stapled to the side of a house :shock:

We're not that crude...
 
Here is a fairly typical New England area service on a multifamily dwelling.

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The riser could have been SE as well but the installer chose PVC.
 
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