Do installed receptacles need to always be hot ?

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Every receptacle in my house is controlled by a switch. In fact, I bet every single one of you guys, when you install receptacles, they are controlled by a switch. Think of the switches _required_ to comply with with article 240 :)

I see no problem with an _additional_ switch located in a convenient location allowing power to be removed from the receptacles in a room.

-Jon
 
winnie said:
Every receptacle in my house is controlled by a switch. In fact, I bet every single one of you guys, when you install receptacles, they are controlled by a switch. Think of the switches _required_ to comply with with article 240 :)

I see no problem with an _additional_ switch located in a convenient location allowing power to be removed from the receptacles in a room.

-Jon
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infinity said:
Hmm...if you put in the required lighting outlets in a bathroom or kitchen do they need to actually light up the room?
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K8MHZ said:
Not 24/7. They can be turned off, obviously. Why can't receptacles also be turned off?
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Who is saying that the receptacles cannot be turned off? You quoted me so I'm assuming that you think that is what I'm saying, I'm not saying that.
 
I didn't read the thread. Don't care to. I say the entire outlet can be switched. If you need it to be powered, you turn the switch on. Common sense over rides the stupid NEC any day of the week.
 
It would seem the inspector could fail the inspection because he couldn't test polarity or see if the GFI functions correctly. Other than that, I see nowhere in the code that says they have to be hot all the time. And, they all have a switch. Its called the breaker at the panel!

This looks like an assumption never thought through by all the code geniuses...
 
I came into this one late, and the discussion is spinning my head around (need more coffee!). Here is my view:

  1. Let’s say that the room under discussion has an overhead light that is controlled by a wall switch.
  2. Exception 1 to 210.70(A)(1) is therefore not relevant.
  3. As a result, paragraph 210.52(2) is also not relevant.
  4. If I were to install a wall switch that turns on and off one or more (or for that matter all) of the wall-mounted receptacles in the room, those receptacles would not be “controlled by a wall switch in accordance with 210.70(A)(1), Exception 1.”
  5. I conclude that those receptacle can be counted as the receptacles required under 210.52.

Bottom line: no code violation.
 
Gary11734 said:
It would seem the inspector could fail the inspection because he couldn't test polarity or see if the GFI functions correctly. Other than that, I see nowhere in the code that says they have to be hot all the time. And, they all have a switch. Its called the breaker at the panel!

This looks like an assumption never thought through by all the code geniuses...
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Why couldn’t he check polarity? If you use a double pole switch, the neutral and live are still on opposite sides, just switched off at the switch. So, your polarity test should be the same. Might be a difference in impedance, but should not be much. Gfci should work as well, but would put it in front of the switch, not load side of the switch.
 
charlie b said:
I came into this one late, and the discussion is spinning my head around (need more coffee!). Here is my view:

  1. Let’s say that the room under discussion has an overhead light that is controlled by a wall switch.
  2. Exception 1 to 210.70(A)(1) is therefore not relevant.
  3. As a result, paragraph 210.52(2) is also not relevant.
  4. If I were to install a wall switch that turns on and off one or more (or for that matter all) of the wall-mounted receptacles in the room, those receptacles would not be “controlled by a wall switch in accordance with 210.70(A)(1), Exception 1.”
  5. I conclude that those receptacle can be counted as the receptacles required under 210.52.

Bottom line: no code violation.
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Thank you!
 
petersonra said:
I think you could switch both receptacles on a duplex outlet but this provision would require you to have another receptacle to cover the required receptacles in a room if you did that.
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I think not, Bob. As a couple of earlier posts have said, if you have a wall-switched overhead light, then the notion of "wall-switched lighting outlet" is not relevant. The Exception is telling us that you can do the one in lieu of the other. It does not say that anytime you wall-switch a receptacle, that receptacle becomes defined as a "lighting outlet."

 
petersonra said:
I think you could switch both receptacles on a duplex outlet but this provision would require you to have another receptacle to cover the required receptacles in a room if you did that.
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Why? Are both used for lighting? If it is used for the required lighting for the room then it does not fall under the required receptacle in the room for outlets anyway. Nothing says we cannot design the outlets to be switched off at a location, only that the be spaced apart, and be separate from the lighting circuits that are switched.
Now, would it make sense to switch them both separately? That is a different question but falls under design.
 
charlie b said:
I came into this one late, and the discussion is spinning my head around (need more coffee!). Here is my view:

  1. Let’s say that the room under discussion has an overhead light that is controlled by a wall switch.
  2. Exception 1 to 210.70(A)(1) is therefore not relevant.
  3. As a result, paragraph 210.52(2) is also not relevant.
  4. If I were to install a wall switch that turns on and off one or more (or for that matter all) of the wall-mounted receptacles in the room, those receptacles would not be “controlled by a wall switch in accordance with 210.70(A)(1), Exception 1.”
  5. I conclude that those receptacle can be counted as the receptacles required under 210.52.

Bottom line: no code violation.
Click to expand...

:thumbsup: perfectly said, and I don't see any flaw in the logic. I would add that if I had a single receptacle designated for required lighting in the room and then I had a switch that turned off all the receptacles then it would still be in line with what you wrote above. In fact the required lighting outlet switch could be overridden by the receptacle switch and be turned off too. In fact, it would probably satisfy the Title 24 ASHRAE 90 crowd, and if they are reading this it might become the next additional cost in new construction.
 
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