No one is saying it comes into play. We're just stating the requirements.Yes I know what it says but I still don't see how it comes into play. I haven't seen a residential refrigerator that even comes close to 12 amps.
No one is saying it comes into play. We're just stating the requirements.Yes I know what it says but I still don't see how it comes into play. I haven't seen a residential refrigerator that even comes close to 12 amps.
I don't understand-- as I stated most refrigerator are rated much less than 12 amps. I believe they are 6 or 7 amps or so. It would not affect the moving of the refrigerator. I am not sure how that got thrown in the mix.What do you call it if the refrigerator is moved to another room/area? (Other than a violation :roll![]()
You are mixing two different issues being discussed. The one you replied to is regarding whether a refrigerator 15A IBC is an SABC or not.I don't understand-- as I stated most refrigerator are rated much less than 12 amps. I believe they are 6 or 7 amps or so. It would not affect the moving of the refrigerator. I am not sure how that got thrown in the mix.
I agree if there is a refrigerator out there rated 13 amps then it would be an issue
I agree it is an IBC, but it is still in the SABC section
and nothing there states that it becomes a general purpose branch circuit.
this makes it an "individual outlet, small appliance branch circuit" if you want to call it that.
What do you call it if the refrigerator is moved to another room/area? (Other than a violation :roll![]()
I am serious. You're the only one saying it is clearly intended for a refrigerator. I made no such indication of that.Are you asking what I would call a receptacle located in a dwelling unit kitchen, in the vacant spot that is clearly intended for a refrigerator?
You can't be serious.
The exception permits a receptacle for refrigerator to be on a 15A individual branch circuit rather than a 20A multi-outlet circuit. Other than being rated 15A, what makes this any different than a 20A IBC for anything else in the kitchen (other than those receptacles eliminated from consideration under 210.52 general). Each receptacle could be a 20A IBC SABC.(C) Dwelling Units.
(1) Small-Appliance Branch Circuits. In addition to the
number of branch circuits required by other parts of this
section, two or more 20-ampere small-appliance branch circuits
shall be provided for all receptacle outlets specified by
210.52(B).
I agree
I agree
No, the exception to the rule tells us directly it we can supply the outlet with an IBC.
To me this as as easy as it gets yet smart and often you like to make things as complicated as possible for reasons I cannot fathom. :lol:
Correct. Even though it is permitted to be excluded from calculation, it's still an indication, for all intents and purposes, it is an SABC as the exclusion is permitted, not required.It kind of doesn't really matter when applying 210.52 requirements, but when trying to do load calculations it does matter whether or not it is considered an additional SABC.
Correct. Even though it is permitted to be excluded from calculation, it's still an indication, for all intents and purposes, it is an SABC as the exclusion is permitted, not required.
When I saw this thread had gone on for over 30 posts I thought the same thing.Wow...just wow. :slaphead:
What dwelling calculation?Interesting that mike holt has the refrigerator listed in the dwelling calculation along with water heaters etc.
What dwelling calculation?
Regardless, he's human just like everyone else...![]()
The spreadsheet author is Thomas J Lepore, created 2/2/1999, last modified 12/13/2011.Go here and download the dwelling spreadsheet http://www.mikeholt.com/technical-calculations-formulas.php
I have to assume Mr. Lepore is also human...![]()
Exactly... but if [it] is not, the oversight is inexcusable...But you have no real proof of that , do you..:lol:
Interesting that mike holt has the refrigerator listed in the dwelling calculation along with water heaters etc.