Electrician's Success International???

[Joe R]

If an auto mechanic quotes you a price to replace your brakes and after getting into the job he finds the rotors need turned he calls and explains that the rotors are bad and need turned or replaced and then quotes an additional amount for this.

Your car is running poorly and you take it to a mechanic. He tells you a tune-up should solve the problem and quotes you a price for the work.
The tune-up doesn't help and he looks further into the problem. He discovers the engine needs completely rebuilt.

Would you expect him to rebuild the engine at no cost because he said a tune-up should solve the problem?

Or would you expect him to not charge for the tune-up and quote you a price to have the engine rebuilt?

I would sue him and take my car else where:grin: he should have done a diagnostic test beforehand and found out a tune up would not do. :wink: i get ur point, i guess there r pros and cons to t&m vs flat rate if i call for service on my ac i need to know the per hour cost or if its flat rate if there is any trip charge, same with electrical if i was on the customer end i would ask the same of the EC. its like going to the grocery store if the price is not on the goods i ask first i would not expect to pay $100 for a gallon of milk when the cashier rings it up just because i didn't ask and the price was not on the prouduct. as for phone qoutes i would call it a prelimanary price which could change + or - depending on the job when i get there and start working on the problem. i have learned if i run into a senerio like the one i posted i say " let the customer know the situation and get an approval from someone ie: landlord, husband, wife etc, before the work goes on u never want to here "I DIDN"T APPROVE THAT THERE IS NO WAY I AM PAYING FOR THAT "!

 

[satcom]

I must of said this 100 times, service calls are not the same as scheduled jobs, and the dispatch fee, comes nowhere near covering the cost of dispatching an electrician.

When our washer had problems, we called for service, they gave us a date with a 9AM to 5PM window, they also put a $90 charge on our credit card, before responding to the call, no credit, no response, they know eniough from years of service experience what it takes to run a service business.
The day of the service call I happened to be home, when the tech arrived, he came in and went to the basement, checked the machine, and wrote up a repair quote, I would not have to pay another call fee, if I accepted the repair work. He was there a total of less then 15 minutes. I asked him how many of these calls do you usually do in day, he said it varies, but between 6 and 8

Now remember these are appliance techs, not electricians. Where talking about a real business that generates income, and is able to weather the changing market place, not someone working for a paycheck, with no means of building a business with assets. Bottom line an efficent service company needs to produce cash flow and profits, to continue in business.

 

[Joe R]

I must of said this 100 times, service calls are not the same as scheduled jobs, and the dispatch fee, comes nowhere near covering the cost of dispatching an electrician.

i counted, u said it 99 times:grin: what do you mean ur dispatch fee does not cover the cost of dispatching the tech, why even have a dispatch fee, that sounds odd:-?

 

[satcom]

i counted, u said it 99 times:grin: what do you mean ur dispatch fee does not cover the cost of dispatching the tech, why even have a dispatch fee, that sounds odd:-?

Yes I agree for someone not running a business, and not knowing all the costs involved, it would sound odd. Some business use the dispatch fee to offset part of the costs, and others may charge more or less, these charges will differ form one company to another.

 

[romexking]

i counted, u said it 99 times:grin: what do you mean ur dispatch fee does not cover the cost of dispatching the tech, why even have a dispatch fee, that sounds odd:-?

The dispatch fee is meant to offset the some of the cost of the travel time, but more importantly, it is meant to distinguish people that are really interested in having work done, from those that are just getting prices.

Every contractor HAS TO charge a dispatch fee. It might not be broken out for the customer, but it certainly cost money to send an electrician and truck to someone's home so this cost might be hidden in the hourly rate or by adding an extra 1/2 hour of time to the ticket. This cost HAS TO be passed on to the customers in some way. If you do not charge a dispatch fee, the customers that do decide to use you are actually paying more to cover the cost of sending an electrician on the calls that decide not to use you. That doesn't sound very fair to me.

As for what we tell them about an inoperable GFCI is that it is impossible to tell WHY the GFCI went bad without actually examining the circuit. At that time, we can give an guaranteed price to repair their problem. We then inform them about our small dispatch fee.

 

[khixxx]

I was at the garage getting a new oil pan gasket. I was told $400. I then asked how much to change out something else sense the engine was kinda apart. They told me it would be the same price as if they didn't touch the vehicle. HUH? another trip to the garage my check engine light was coming on. They told me it was this. So they repaired it. Engine light still on. They told me it was that. engine light still on. I had to pay for this and that and still the light was on. After rounds with the service manager I finally took truck to Joes garage and it was fixed at 1/4 the cost of the big garage.

However I took my car in for break repair they told me X amount I said ok be back in 3 hours. I went back in 3 hours and the guy told me he had a heck of a time. everything was froze up and he just got it back together. He still charged me X amount. It would have taken an unprepared garage longer if they didn't have the proper equipment.

Moral of the story, BACK YOUR SERVICE UP if your going to charge crazy prices, or you won't last long.

Numerous times we had to do T&M for a company because they wanted us on site. They know if we left it would be awhile before they got us back.

 

[aline]

My dispatch fee doesn't even come close to covering my expense to go out to the job. My dispatch fee is nothing more than a fee to come out and quote a price for diagnosing the problem and making the repair. It's not a troubleshooting fee, a service call fee or a repair fee.

My expenses to go out to the job are covered in my job prices. That's why I can waive the dispatch fee if they accept the work.

There's no such thing as a free estimate unless you never buy anything.
Someone has to pay for estimates and quess who that someone is.
Hint. It's not the contractor.

We all pay for shoplifters. We all pay for free estimates.

When you buy that gallon of milk part of that money goes to the shoplifters. When you pay to have that new swimming pool installed part of that money goes to the free estimates.

 

[Paul Allen]

We also charge a dispatch fee. The fee does not cover the entire cost of dispatching a technician to the customers home, but it does offset it somewhat. We do not have the time or resources to ride around town all day giving FREE estimates. This works ok for construction jobs, but not service work. We tell customers that free estimates are not free, we just tell you upfront what its going to cost to get a tech out to their home. People have the option at this time to call someone else. Another mistake we see is the company who gives an estimate over the phone. Estimates over the phone are misleading and many times a flat out lie! We do not quote prices over the phone, but we go out and look at the job and give them an exact price. Not a ballpark. There are a lot of customers that appreciate this, Even if it cost them a little more for a dispatch fee. I was at a customers home last week that got charged 950.00 to install a GFCI circuit to a bathroom because it took them all day to do it by a T&M contractor. Our Price for this would have been about 1/2 of this and could have been done in 1-2 hrs. The customer called us because he was robbed by the T&M Company. To me I would have been more apprehensive to tell a customer they owed us 900.00 after the work is done than to show them what its going to cost BEFORE we do the work where we only have a little bit of travel labor invested. As an owner it also sucks dealing with a disgruntled customer trying to justify why it took your sorry tech all day to do something that could have been done in a fraction of the time.

 

[emahler]

add to that Paul...at the end of that long day, you've already invested all your time and material....what if the customer refuses to pay? what recourse do you really have? small claims court?

at least with flat rate, you limit that possibility...they know the price up front...they sign and agree to the price up front...

 

[satcom]

add to that Paul...at the end of that long day, you've already invested all your time and material....what if the customer refuses to pay? what recourse do you really have? small claims court?

at least with flat rate, you limit that possibility...they know the price up front...they sign and agree to the price up front...

Simple no contract, no work, we are contractors not piece workers, I need a signed approval, before i invest my time in a job.

 

[cowboyjwc]

That service tech that came out at $90 to give you a quote has no desire to repair your washer if he can help it. If they don't fix a thing they are making about $900 a day.

The one that did that to me came out and told me I needed a new transmisson for the dryer at a cost of $400. I only paid $250 for it in the first place. The second guy came out and replaced the plastic bushing that it actually needed for about $50. I threatened to report the first guy to the BBB if he didn't refund my money. The tech was at my door with my check in his hand a half hour later.

They know how to make money all right and they also know how they're making it.

 

[aline]

I only paid $250 for it in the first place. The second guy came out and replaced the plastic bushing that it actually needed for about $50.

I'm glad I don't repair appliances.
I can't imagine charging only $50 for a service call.
I hope you mean the repair was only $50 on top of the service call fee.

I need to get over a hundred dollars on a service call to make any money.

 

[bkludecke]

I just got back from a service call. The HO called a plumber to check out why the garbage disposal wouldn't work. The plumber plugged a tester into the outlet servicing the GD, had no power told the HO to call an electrician and charged him $60. I came out and changed the switch and got my service call fee. While the HO understood the plumber can't work for free, he will never call that plumber again nor refer him to others. Things are getting pretty tight here in SO CAL these days and this is a VERY small town. I believe that my business has survived and prospered for 30+ years because I treated people fairly and cut some slack many times when I was called out only to find it was the plumbers problem. This plumber is a member of an outfit similar to ESI and has a reputation for insisting on his fee no matter what. I doubt that he can continue to do this in this small community for long, especially as the economy here slows down. I'm not saying he is wrong, I'm just a different type of business.

 

[emahler]

2 things...the customer should have called you first....

2nd, we don't get paid for what we do, we get paid for what we know.

the plumber knew how to determine the problem. he knew enough to know that it wasn't something he could fix.

should he offer this service for free? will this customer ever really be satisfied?

one thing that occurs when you sign on with any business group/system, you learn your true costs. once the reality of your true costs hit you square in the face, it becomes hard to give away your time for free.

 

[bkludecke]

Alot of us who have been doing this for quite some time have come to realize the VALUE of goodwill and the VALUE of giving things away. Many successful enterprises go out of their way to give good customer service and build a loyal customer base by "throwing a bone" now and then. Some do sales or senior discounts or charity work... the list goes on. I do know my true costs of doing business, I look closely at the numbers continuously (for over 30 years now). I treat my employees fairly, they earn top $ and benefits and they are loyal to me in return. For me this is not a game to see how much profit I can squeeze out of this town in my lifetime. Rather it is a rewarding career the fulfills me in many many ways only one of which is money. I have no problem with someone else's way of conducting business for themselves; it takes all kinds to make the world turn. The "take no prisoners" approach would not work for me no matter how much more money I could make.

 

[macmikeman]

I need ten letters to make this here edit button to work.

 

[emahler]

it's not about squeezing every dime...my point was, most customers don't care about us...they don't care if we make money or lose money....they don't care if we are in business next year. There are always exceptions to the rule, but if they cared, they would pay us above our asking price.....

there is a certain value to goodwill and giving things away...but can anyone actually quantify that value?

another way to look at it is this....you need to make $100,000 gross for the year....you will only be able to run 2000 calls total....you will need to average $50/call.....do 10% of your calls (200) as freebies, and you now need to average $55/call..

someone, somewhere, somehow is paying for that goodwill and that freebie...you can pass it along to other customers, or you can charge it to the benefactor....or you can take it out of the pockets of your employees and families....

like you said, it's not right or wrong, i'm just playing devil's advocate...

 

[aline]

The plumber plugged a tester into the outlet servicing the GD, had no power told the HO to call an electrician and charged him $60. I came out and changed the switch and got my service call fee. While the HO understood the plumber can't work for free, he will never call that plumber again nor refer him to others.

In my opinion this customer has an attitude problem.

If the HO really understood the plumber can't work for free he wouldn't feel this way.

I would be happy that the plumber was knowledgable enough to quickly diagnose the problem and only charge $60 for coming out. That's dirt cheap for a service call. I wouldn't have had a problem with paying the $60 at all.

If the plumber came out, threw up his hands and said; "I have no idea what's wrong" and collected $60 that might be different.

Between the $60 and your service call fee the customer got his problem fixed for a reasonable cost. He should be happy.

Maybe the plumber should have called an electrician and hired him as a subcontractor to go out and fix the problem, have the electrician bill him instead of the homeowner, mark up the electrician's bill and then send one bill to the customer from the plumber. Some companies have plumbing, HVAC and electrical divisions all under one company name.

This way the plumber could have actually made some money on this call.

Someone has to pay for the expense of the plumber coming out. If that customer doesn't pay for it who does? Most likely the plumbers other customers. Nothing is free. If your giving away freebies that expense has to be made up somewhere. If your considering this advertising then its an advertising expense. Who pays for your advertising expenses? Your customers do.

You go to the doctor, he examines you and refers you to a specialist. Should he not charge you for the examination because he didn't do anything but send you to a specialist?

 

[JohnJ0906]

we don't get paid for what we do, we get paid for what we know.

Thank you. Great point

 

[bkludecke]

Well, I don't believe there is a right or wrong answer to all of this dialog. We are about the highest priced (hourly & bid work) EC in the area and our Electricians also have the best pay/benefits by far. We have built a large and loyal customer base so I guess my views and approach to service work is biased somewhat. I am lucky in that I really do like service work and troubleshooting so even on those occasions when I don't feel like charging full price at least I had a good time. Heck some folks actually pay money to have fun and be entertained; guess I'm no different.