EMF

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jxofaltrds said:
IMHO we have know this for years. Remember when they did not want us sitting in front of the TV.

Moving a clock radio away from you when you sleep has helped people with headaches.
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The biggest issue with tube TVs is the X-rays that are generated by the electron beam in the CRT. One of the reasons they were so heavy is because of all the lead shielding that blocked these X-rays. The EMFs from the deflection coils radiate in all directions, but did you ever hear someone tell you to not sit close to the side of the TV?

The clock radio thing has two possible causes that are more plausible than EMFs: Firstly, the light. Either the light itself or the imperceptable flickering of the LEDs. Second plausible cause is actually sound. It's been found that many small electronics emit high-frequency (15kHz+) sound that you don't notice but still effects you negatively.
 
I had a customer walking around with a gaussmeter and putting it right up to the wall plate of a 4 gang switch plate and then complain that she was reading 6 mg when the lights were on. I told her to move the meter 2 " away and there was nothing. She couldn't let it go even when I showed her that her stereo was putting out 76 mg even when it was off but plugged in. That didn't bother her----she also had a plug in carbon detector and it was putting out a significant amount of electromagnetic field's but again the 3 or 6 mg gotten at the switches were driving her nuts.

There is too much stuff on the web that may be accurate to some degree but it often does not fully explain things. Everyday this customer of mine would email me about something she read on the web. Last thing was about the bonding of sub panels.. She was so sure that was what was making her feel funny-- I finally broke the news to her- "I'm sorry but you don't have a sub panel". She asked me 4 times on different days- she either didn't believe me or she was losing it and forgetting that I answered her.

BTW,this was a new house that I got called in after it was finished and they were living there for a few months
 
Dennis Alwon said:
There is too much stuff on the web that may be accurate to some degree but it often does not fully explain things. Everyday this customer of mine would email me about something she read on the web. Last thing was about the bonding of sub panels.. She was so sure that was what was making her feel funny-- I finally broke the news to her- "I'm sorry but you don't have a sub panel". She asked me 4 times on different days- she either didn't believe me or she was losing it and forgetting that I answered her.
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it's a systemic disorder that affects some people in everything they do.

a pervasive level of fear regarding almost everything. it is corrosive
and damaging, and the entire fabric of some peoples existence seems
shot thru with it.

alcoholics and folk with similar afflictions drink as a result of it, and alcoholism
maims and kills a hell of a lot more people than emf's, i will wager.
alcoholism, per se, isn't the problem, it is the solution.
the problem is the pervasive fear.

now, pervasive fear has little to do with emf's, but a hell of a lot to do with
everything else, and yet there is not a meter developed that can be placed
near a person, and will measure and quantify pathological fear.

i suspect a lot of people would peg the meter.

as to emf's, i don't know what unsafe levels are, a safe assumption is that less
is better. just like fear.

but if you take a frightened person, and ask them about their fear, they will
usually explain to you in great detail, how the fear is an awareness that keeps
them safe.

thank god i can remove fear. there is a process for that. emf's are a bit harder.
if i'm afraid of the lightswitch, then i just have to sit in the dark, consumed by fear.
 
iwire said:
Full T, nice post. :thumbsup:
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I agree with FT's comment also. I have relatives' that have a unhealthily fear of germs. They spray Lysol all around and wipe every thing down with Clorox wipes to kill germs. But, they stay sick with colds and such all the time. Yet, you cannot make them believe that we need the normal germs to keep our immune system up so it can fight off the bad ones thus they stay sick.
 
ceb58 said:
I agree with FT's comment also. I have relatives' that have a unhealthily fear of germs. They spray Lysol all around and wipe every thing down with Clorox wipes to kill germs. But, they stay sick with colds and such all the time. Yet, you cannot make them believe that we need the normal germs to keep our immune system up so it can fight off the bad ones thus they stay sick.
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Amen to that. I guess working in the field often having no place to wash up and then having to eat lunch we got our share of germs. I rarely missed a day of work due to illness , so did the germs help- who knows but some people are ridiculous about it.
 
Fulthrotl said:
it's a systemic disorder that affects some people in everything they do.

a pervasive level of fear regarding almost everything. it is corrosive
and damaging, and the entire fabric of some peoples existence seems
shot thru with it.

alcoholics and folk with similar afflictions drink as a result of it, and alcoholism
maims and kills a hell of a lot more people than emf's, i will wager.
alcoholism, per se, isn't the problem, it is the solution.
the problem is the pervasive fear.

now, pervasive fear has little to do with emf's, but a hell of a lot to do with
everything else, and yet there is not a meter developed that can be placed
near a person, and will measure and quantify pathological fear.

i suspect a lot of people would peg the meter.

as to emf's, i don't know what unsafe levels are, a safe assumption is that less
is better. just like fear.

but if you take a frightened person, and ask them about their fear, they will
usually explain to you in great detail, how the fear is an awareness that keeps
them safe.

thank god i can remove fear. there is a process for that. emf's are a bit harder.
if i'm afraid of the lightswitch, then i just have to sit in the dark, consumed by fear.
Click to expand...


This same individual is trying to get the power company to remove the smart meter because of the radio waves... When I got there she told me she couldn't sleep in the master bedroom because of the electromagnetic field's. Now there were high levels which I fixed however she had a kill switch in the master bedroom that disconnected the entire circuit yet she still said the electromagnetic field's were the culprit. I told her and showed her that when the switch was off there were no electromagnetic field's.

IMO, this persons responses are all in her head. I finally had to walk on the job- it wasn't worth hours and hours of conversations and emails with her without compensation. She is trying to find someone else and every time she calls someone they call me. Needless to say they wont take on the job because she has not paid many of her subs on the original job....She is infamous in town -- all the supply companies know of her and everyone I work with has heard stories...
 
I had a neighbor who if still alive today would be scared to death about smart meters. She would hide from jet contrails, have her home sprayed monthly with some magic citrus something that was supposed to scare the goblins away, etc. She was a very sweet old lady who was scared out of her skin by everything she could find on the internet. There is no cure for that in our industry; that's a whole different area of science and I think you need a MD to treat it, not a screwdriver & a pair of Klines.
 
Oh jeez, the contrails... Best response to that is "If it's all a government conspiracy (Agenda 21,etc) why did they make them visible to the naked eye? Are you telling me that they can make invisible aerosol bathroom spray that smells like peaches, but they can't make invisible aerosol death spray?"

For a clincher you can show them the old water cooler jug + bicycle pump trick and then proceed to drink the remnants of water.

And I'm going to bite my tongue for the moment on the smart meter issue lest I drive my face through the monitor...
 
Dennis Alwon said:
There is too much stuff on the web that may be accurate to some degree but it often does not fully explain things. Everyday this customer of mine would email me about something she read on the web. Last thing was about the bonding of sub panels.. She was so sure that was what was making her feel funny-- I finally broke the news to her- "I'm sorry but you don't have a sub panel". She asked me 4 times on different days- she either didn't believe me or she was losing it and forgetting that I answered her.

BTW,this was a new house that I got called in after it was finished and they were living there for a few months
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I also like What FullThrottle posted on here about fear. At one time in my life, I had a doctor tell me that I had, what he called, "2nd year medical student syndrome." I asked him what that was. He replied, that is when you start studying all the different diesases out there and then you think you have one. Now then I am NOT saying do not increase your knowledge, or even throw away your concern ( which would be foolish). But if it was something to really be concerned about, the issue would be addressed more often... :)
 
And always consider the source of the information.

If the power industry pays the tab for a study on EMF from transmission lines, I'm not going to waste my time reading it.

If that same study is commissioned by NIH or American Cancer Society, I'm all ears.

And if those things were significant, those entities would be right on it; they're not.
 
mgookin said:
And always consider the source of the information.

If the power industry pays the tab for a study on EMF from transmission lines, I'm not going to waste my time reading it.

If that same study is commissioned by NIH or American Cancer Society, I'm all ears.

And if those things were significant, those entities would be right on it; they're not.
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That is always a good thing to do...it always seems that the study reflects the views of those who paid for it.

Same thing with the "articles" in the electrical trade magazines...the first thing I look at is who does the author work for, then I will read the article.
 
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Personally, I would worry more about the constant use of the Cell Phone up to her ear on a daily basis before I would worry about the EMF situation. I also would question how the readings were taken, by whom they were taken and where the actual readings were taken.

I also recall eating eggs would harm me, then they are ok to eat; then milk was bad to drink in large amounts to end up not being bad for you and so on. While prolonged exposure to severe high levels of EMF may (I stress may) cause hypersensitive individuals some possibly problems I am not ready to say it is like...the next RADON.

Anyway just my thoughts on it. I don't totally discount EMF but believe it is all relative and the jury is still out on the overall affects.
 
I keep hearing "fix the problem with EMF".

My question is what do you do?

I don't have any calls or desire to have any on EMF, just curious as to what the "fix" is!
 
Little Bill said:
I keep hearing "fix the problem with EMF".

My question is what do you do?

I don't have any calls or desire to have any on EMF, just curious as to what the "fix" is!
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Mostly fixing grounding / bonding issues (multiple bonds = bad) and otherwise following the NEC.

In a K&T building the neutral may run separately from the hot and that will cause higher EMF.
 
Little Bill said:
I keep hearing "fix the problem with EMF".

My question is what do you do?

I don't have any calls or desire to have any on EMF, just curious as to what the "fix" is!
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I agree with iwire (what..have I been drinking?) just kidding!

My most recent experience with this issue was in a 12 story apartment complex. The readings where high (can't remember) and basically the person living in the building was concerned. They purchased a Gauss Meter and began taking readings all over their apartment and then after reading a few books (from experts) felt they were now an expert and began to complain to the building owners.

long story short...I did find that roughly 150 hall luminaries were incorrectly grounded on every floor....in fact many not at all and the small XFMR on the luminaries stated the need for it to be grounded properly so we made the entire building do it (yes, we did because our building official also lived in the building...well you know what that means)...

Anyway, the levels did decrease in certain areas but not in all of the areas the condo owner wanted...so basically if the hall wiring is any indication of other wiring in the units themselves then clearly we see the culprit of the elevated EMF. End result is no substantial documentation to hang a hat on, the owners did not want to bring in a EMF Specialist so the option was live with it or move.

To the best of my knowledge the condo owner gave up the fight and just lives there with tin foil on their head...so as to not absorb the ill effects of their elevated EMF...(tongue in cheek remark, please forgive me)

So yes...I agree with iwire;)
 
Little Bill said:
I keep hearing "fix the problem with EMF".

My question is what do you do?

I don't have any calls or desire to have any on EMF, just curious as to what the "fix" is!
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Common Causes of EMF but not the only

1. If the EGC is touching the grounded conductor after the OCPD.
2. If the grounded conductor from two different circuits are connected together after the Ocpd. I see this in 2 or 3 gang switches where either the neutrals get crossed or they are all tied together.
3. If the circuit conductor are not run together as in K&T wiring or sometimes you see this in 3 way switches where the EC runs 2 wire cable between the 3 ways and picks up a neutral at one box and the feed at the other.
 
Little Bill said:
I keep hearing "fix the problem with EMF".

My question is what do you do?

I don't have any calls or desire to have any on EMF, just curious as to what the "fix" is!
Click to expand...
"Silencing the Fields" by Edward A. Leeper is an easy to understand basics book on EMF's and how to reduce them.

Roger
 
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