Extending 12/2 Romex

[jap]

and neither the adapter or the appliance are part of the premises wiring - and not covered by NEC.

Correct.

The difference is who installs the adapter in my opinion.

The home owner who doesn't know any better if the now new 120v receptacle outlet now may falls into an area where GFI protection may be required, or an electrician who plugs in the adapter that does without changing the standard 2p 50 breaker out to a GFI if required.

JAP>

 

[jap]

Well, I didn't go into detail but yes, I spliced a piece of 12 onto the ungrounded conductor.

Roger

I knew you did Roger.

Just stirring it up a little.

JAP>

 

[jap]

Just checked,,,, Eaton Br series will accept a #4 even down to a 10 amp miniature circuit breaker.


JAP>

 

[kwired]

Sure they will,,,

Even down to a 15 amp on some.

JAP>

Most will take up to 8 AWG but can't recall ever seeing one that takes a 6 AWG until you go over 30 amp device. This be your typical miniature breaker that plugs on in "loadcenters". Commercial/industrial panels may vary more.

 

[kwired]

Correct.

The difference is who installs the adapter in my opinion.

The home owner who doesn't know any better if the now new 120v receptacle outlet now may falls into an area where GFI protection may be required, or an electrician who plugs in the adapter that does without changing the standard 2p 50 breaker out to a GFI if required.

JAP>

If listed for the purpose why should that matter?

 

[jap]

Most will take up to 8 AWG but can't recall ever seeing one that takes a 6 AWG until you go over 30 amp device. This be your typical miniature breaker that plugs on in "loadcenters". Commercial/industrial panels may vary more.

Yes, your standard every day miniature BR Series plug in load center breaker for example will accept a #4 even down to a 1p 10 amp.

JAP>

 

[kwired]

Yes, your standard every day miniature BR Series plug in load center breaker for example will accept a #4 even down to a 1p 10 amp.

JAP>

I don't use much BR, but have noticed they do have larger lugs than they once did.

 

[jap]

If listed for the purpose why should that matter?

I guess because the every day home owner wouldn't know if they've created a code violation by using the adapter if it was in a place that the now 120v outlet required GFI protection where as an electrician would.

The electrician would more than likely take the steps to install the GFI protection if it was now required I would think.

Unlike a plug strip or a wall wart where the average person simply plugs it in, and, what it's plugged into hasn't changed what's coming out of the receptacle that would violate a code.

Plug a plug strip into a counter top receptacle and you're gfi protected if the outlet you plugged it into is gfi protected, or, if prior to the rule and it's not GFI protected it's not, but, that was an existing 120v receptacle so it doesn't matter.

Plug a wall wart into a receptacle and you haven't violated anything either. It's simply going to create a voltage other than the source voltage as it should without even having to think about it whether the outlet is GFI protected or not.

Plug this adapter into an existing 50 amp outlet and as long as the rule hasn't changed from when the 50 amp outlet was installed an your good and nothing else to think about.

But,

Plug this adapter into an existing 50 amp 240v outlet where the now 120 volts is being used in a place that may require 120v GFI protection where it once didn't, and, they've violated a code that they probably didn't even know existed.

An electrician may use the adapter, but the rules for 240v outlets and 120v outlets are different depending on when the outlet was installed , and, if this now 120v outlet is in a place that now requires GFI protection he should protect it.

Oh well,,, we did learn the lugs on miniature breakers may be larger than what we originally thought they would be if nothing else.

JAP>

 

[kwired]

I guess because the every day home owner wouldn't know if they've created a code violation by using the adapter if it was in a place that the now 120v outlet required GFI protection where as an electrician would.

The electrician would more than likely take the steps to install the GFI protection if it was now required I would think.

Unlike a plug strip or a wall wart where the average person simply plugs it in, and, what it's plugged into hasn't changed what's coming out of the receptacle that would violate a code.

Plug a plug strip into a counter top receptacle and you're gfi protected if the outlet you plugged it into is gfi protected, or, if prior to the rule and it's not GFI protected it's not, but, that was an existing 120v receptacle so it doesn't matter.

Plug a wall wart into a receptacle and you haven't violated anything either. It's simply going to create a voltage other than the source voltage as it should without even having to think about it whether the outlet is GFI protected or not.

Plug this adapter into an existing 50 amp outlet and as long as the rule hasn't changed from when the 50 amp outlet was installed an your good and nothing else to think about.

But,

Plug this adapter into an existing 50 amp 240v outlet where the now 120 volts is being used in a place that may require 120v GFI protection where it once didn't, and, they've violated a code that they probably didn't even know existed.

An electrician may use the adapter, but the rules for 240v outlets and 120v outlets are different depending on when the outlet was installed , and, if this now 120v outlet is in a place that now requires GFI protection he should protect it.

Oh well,,, we did learn the lugs on miniature breakers may be larger than what we originally thought they would be if nothing else.

JAP>

My stance is if listed for the purpose there is no code violation.

GFCI and or AFCI protection possibly can factor into this though. Might even make them come out with listed adapters that incorporate it. As far as a HO not knowing requirements, kind of no different than if they replaced a "regular receptacle" and did not update it to AFCI/GFCI protection when required by code. A qualified person should be changing the receptacle or using an adapter that meets requirements if one is available, they are supposed to know better. If they know better but don't agree with rules then they likely know the risk they are taking with non compliance.

 

[jap]

My stance is if listed for the purpose there is no code violation.

GFCI and or AFCI protection possibly can factor into this though. Might even make them come out with listed adapters that incorporate it. As far as a HO not knowing requirements, kind of no different than if they replaced a "regular receptacle" and did not update it to AFCI/GFCI protection when required by code. A qualified person should be changing the receptacle or using an adapter that meets requirements if one is available, they are supposed to know better. If they know better but don't agree with rules then they likely know the risk they are taking with non compliance.

I agree.

JAP>