failed by 1 point

[K8MHZ]

Personally if I had only passed by 1 point I would not be to happy with that. I would be concerned that I do not know as much as I should. I would be quite depressed about that. It would surely bother me.

I am depressed now just by reading this post! I would hate to be your kid! LOL.

Some people are good a taking tests. I am one and have been since I was a kid. Some people strive for 100% on tests they take. I am one of those, too.

Some people are terrible at taking tests. I know a few, one in particular is an excellent electrician but had to take his JW test several times because he just plain forgets things when under the stress of taking the test. Some of those people may strive in order just to pass. Having asinine and purposely misleading, sometimes totally incorrect answers makes things worse for those that struggle with taking tests.

When tests are written with ambiguous wording and screwy answers, it affects those that are not good at test taking much more than it does those that are, even if both parties know exactly the same information as applied to the subject being tested.

'Test taking' should not be a required skill for any test other than a test about test taking itself. I had such a test years ago at a real estate class that actually taught the art of test taking. It worked, not only did we all pass the state exam which had only a 40 percent pass rate, we did so in about 1/3 of the time allowed. All our scores were in the 90's. Had we not been taught the art of test taking, I assure you we would have had a much harder time passing that test.

So, I can understand being humbled by only passing by one point since I am used to getting 90 - 101 percent on tests I take. I also understand being happy and proud of only passing by one point. It's probably harder for the people to just make the grade than it is for the likes of people like me that score near or above 100 percent regularly on tests.

 

[mgookin]

When you go to the doctor, what does the paper on the wall say?
It says MD
It does not say "this guy scored nnn.nn % on his blah blah blah test."

C's get degrees!

 

[Transportation Guy]

When you go to the doctor, what does the paper on the wall say?
It says MD
It does not say "this guy scored nnn.nn % on his blah blah blah test."

C's get degrees!

I totally agree! Pass is Pass.

I take great pride in taking tests. If the computer would be generous enough and let me know the instant I pass a test, even only 75% through it, I would take the pass immediately and not finish the test. Pass is Pass! My salary has never been determined on what I made on my QE. It's not an Ivy league education.

 

[Sierrasparky]

Applying your methodology what's the correct answer and why?

I am depressed now just by reading this post! I would hate to be your kid! LOL.

I totally agree! Pass is Pass.

I take great pride in taking tests. If the computer would be generous enough and let me know the instant I pass a test, even only 75% through it, I would take the pass immediately and not finish the test. Pass is Pass! My salary has never been determined on what I made on my QE. It's not an Ivy league education.

Interesting concept. Never thought of it from that perspective. Not Ivy league but there are some safety issues that place lives in your hands.

Applying your methodology what's the correct answer and why?

I think I have posted that already

I am depressed now just by reading this post! I would hate to be your kid! LOL.

I don't grind nor demand or expect such rules in my home. I was just stating my personal view. When I took my test for EC it was a newly updated version. There were no classes on theory or real world electrical. The only classes were practice quiz and I don't do good with those because I don't associate the answer with anything as it's just an answer. I wound up just studying the code book and borrowed a book from a master in another state. I wound up passing in the top. I finished quickly. I knew the material.

Now fast forward to today. I have taken Continue Ed classes that have tests at the end of the class. You get to review your test too as you complete it. I missed quite a few test questions as the class was very fast paced and I did not grasp stuff as quickly as dished out. The stuff I missed I do need to know better. I passed but I was lacking all the necessary info to carry out some of the tasks. I will have to review in order to be competent. The real goal in my opinion it to test competency in performing the work I was tested in. I feel It was not and on my own I will need to review. The test failed its objective.

If we are to be tested on how well we can find answers then why have a test of competency in the area of knowledge we are tested in .

 

[iwire]

If we are to be tested on how well we can find answers ....

In my opinion that should be 95% of an electrician / inspector test.

No one is going to know all that needs to be known in this trade. What you do need to know is how to find the rules / methods.

 

[Sierrasparky]

In my opinion that should be 95% of an electrician / inspector test.

No one is going to know all that needs to be known in this trade. What you do need to know is how to find the rules / methods.

Yea that is why I made that comment. However.


We need to be fluent in our work not doing things twice because we did not know better. The classes I took were on some advanced controls. If I don't know what I am doing then I cannot be too efficcient in what I am tasked for. If I take too long or the customer sees me looking up stuff I should already know I would bet that they would start to get concerned if they are paying by the hour.


Some one commented about Dr's. I would not want to go to a Dr. that went to the worst Med school and barely passed. Just something unsettling about it.

 

[GoldDigger]

And what do you call a judge who had the lowest rank in his law school class?




"Your Honor...."

 

[K8MHZ]

In my opinion that should be 95% of an electrician / inspector test.

No one is going to know all that needs to be known in this trade. What you do need to know is how to find the rules / methods.

In my apprenticeship we spent hours on the subject of 'codology', or how to find things in the code book. It was taught that the book was three parts, plan, build and use. Codology was like a class meant for a law school student.

I think it's sad that our rules are scribed so cryptically we have to have hours and hours of training to be able to understand them and apply them to our craft. 'This refers to that', but not always because of the exception that can only be used if certain criteria that can only be determined by article after article of page jumping and table hopping is met and the inspector has played exactly the same game of electrical rule hop scotch that you have.

 

[normbac]

Do you see the irony.
Every post on this forum would need only one reply if questions had easy answers.

 

[sparky=t]

In my opinion that should be 95% of an electrician / inspector test.

No one is going to know all that needs to be known in this trade. What you do need to know is how to find the rules / methods.

What we need to think about is the op is taking this test so he / she may be able to inspect your or someone's work, one thing to remember when taking a test on the NEC that this is bare minimum requirements, as mentioned above we all can know all there is to be known, however we need to know where to go when we have to...

 

[sparky=t]

I seem to remember that question on the exam, however I can not remember all the answers provided, I was more worried about the poor resolution of the drawings presented that we had to refer to for the practical portion, bone up on the book as the practical may have have taken you out of the game., remember to look for exceptions as you can not enforce general rules if an exception applies.

 

[texie]

I seem to remember that question on the exam, however I can not remember all the answers provided, I was more worried about the poor resolution of the drawings presented that we had to refer to for the practical portion, bone up on the book as the practical may have have taken you out of the game., remember to look for exceptions as you can not enforce general rules if an exception applies.

Bill,
You will be glad to know that it looks like ICC is finally going to address the resolution issue. This all started a few years ago when PearsonVue insisted on converting all drawings from paper to the computer. This has also been a problem with other exams given at PearsonVue for other jurisdictions.
It seems that a guy was so annoyed by it that he filed a formal challenge over this and I have learned that it is going to be addressed (at least in the case of ICC/electrical).

 

[George Stolz]

It's all well and good to tell the OP to challenge the question; no disrespect to the OP, but I can imagine that we did not get the question word for word, and are drawing conclusions based on incomplete information.

I took my CO renewal yesterday morning, and then sat and tried to remember the questions I was presented when I got home. Only an hour had passed, but I couldn't remember all the concepts tested, much less how the questions were worded. Chances are, the question was fairly solid, or it wasn't counted in the score. In CO, they always have a couple trial questions that aren't counted to see if they work or not.

 

[iwire]

I think it's sad that our rules are scribed so cryptically we have to have hours and hours of training to be able to understand them and apply them to our craft.

This is something many people express but I wonder if they have any experience with other standards, regulations or laws? Take a look at how your state laws are written. Are they easy to understand? Is it wise to get training about them to actually work with them?

My point is I think the NEC is written pretty clearly compared to many other things I have tried to understand.

I think it is very tough to write a code book to cover all electrical installations under an infinite number of conditions and not make the book 20,000 pages. JMHO.

 

[ActionDave]

I think it is very tough to write a code book to cover all electrical installations under an infinite number of conditions and not make the book 20,000 pages. JMHO.

I they would just quit sticking their nose in where it doesn't belong, design issues, I think a whole lot of arguments would go away.

I also think it is time to go to a longer code cycle. Five years at least, and if I had my say it would be ten.

 

[Besoeker]

I would contest that question and perhaps get credit for it. The answer is all of the above.

Or, given how the question is worded, maybe none of the above would be appropriate?

Must be solid? No.
Must be stranded? No.
Must be bare? No.
Must be insulated? No.

I agree with what others have said here.
It is a poorly worded question.

 

[Wingrider]

Why complain about this one question

Why complain about this one question

Maybe I am missing the point on this post, but if you had gotten any one of the other 25 questions correct that you missed, this one would not be up for discussion. Study the rest of the ones missed and let this one go.

 

[enigma-2]

i made a 74 on my E2 COMMERCIAL INSPECTORS EXAM,but i will pass this time...1 question was this...A conductor in a raceway must be:
INSULATED
SOLID
STRANDED
BARE
i chose insulated, WRONG, i assume it is stranded ????

Could it have been possible that the question was worded "check all that apply" or similar?

 

[Eddy Current]

i made a 74 on my E2 COMMERCIAL INSPECTORS EXAM,but i will pass this time...1 question was this...A conductor in a raceway must be:
INSULATED
SOLID
STRANDED
BARE

i chose insulated, WRONG, i assume it is stranded ???? i looked at 250.62 and it has all listed,please help me on this 1,it does not say if its a grounding electrode,equip grd ,or Iassume raceway must be a conduit, Ihave seen thwem all in raceways,cable tray,etc....
Let me know your thoughts please..thanks

How do you know this is the question you missed, they usually don't show you the ones you missed unless you pay for an exam review.

 

[Sierrasparky]

How do you know this is the question you missed, they usually don't show you the ones you missed unless you pay for an exam review.

Interesting.
However i think the op is concerned as to the vague nature or the multiple correct possibilities.