Fire pump motor

Azad

Member
Location
Newyork city
If I have a 220 motor and I need to make it work by bringing power in to it from a sub panel nearby, do I have to use a double pole breaker? If not then ,can I get a way by using two separate 20 amp breakers( not double pole) to get two hot legs in to the motor?


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augie47

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Tennessee
As ActionDave states, IF it is truly a fire pump motor, you question is mute as with the requirement of Art 695 you would not be feeding it from a sub-panel.
That said, I've never seen a fire pump motor you would feed with a 20 amp breaker.
A bit more info on exactly what we have would be helpful.
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
Is it a fire pump or is it the pressure maintenance pump connected to the sprinkler system?

That would explain a 20 amp circuit and a sub panel.
 

ADub

Senior Member
Location
Iowa
Probably definitely a jockey pump not a fire pump. And definitely should have an electrician do it


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Azad

Member
Location
Newyork city
It's a big possibility that it is a pressure maintenance pump connected to the sprinkler system . But i am still not convinced that why do I have to use a double pole breaker to supply power to this pump instead of using two single 20 amps to get the needed 220V ?


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infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
It's a big possibility that it is a pressure maintenance pump connected to the sprinkler system . But i am still not convinced that why do I have to use a double pole breaker to supply power to this pump instead of using two single 20 amps to get the needed 220V ?
Generally for a motor two single pole CB's with a handle-tie are permitted.
 

Azad

Member
Location
Newyork city
Wow... What part of my question is strange? I don't understand? Iam asking a simple question and expecting to get a simple answer from you all. I'd like to pose the question again. What is the purpose of using a double pole breaker the feed a motor ( any motor) where you can do the same thing by bringing two separate hot legs from two different single breaks? And if they both serve the same purpose why the handle tie CB's are permitted by the code? And just to let you know (for your own information) I got my license in 2009 , journeyman. If the question is a bit second class to you then you might blame that for my four year gap between the electrcal work and getting a college degree.


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infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
I'd like to pose the question again. What is the purpose of using a double pole breaker the feed a motor ( any motor) where you can do the same thing by bringing two separate hot legs from two different single breaks? And if they both serve the same purpose why the handle tie CB's are permitted by the code?
Your question was answered in post #7.
 

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
Wow... What part of my question is strange? I don't understand? Iam asking a simple question and expecting to get a simple answer from you all. I'd like to pose the question again. What is the purpose of using a double pole breaker the feed a motor ( any motor) where you can do the same thing by bringing two separate hot legs from two different single breaks? And if they both serve the same purpose why the handle tie CB's are permitted by the code? And just to let you know (for your own information) I got my license in 2009 , journeyman. If the question is a bit second class to you then you might blame that for my four year gap between the electrcal work and getting a college degree.


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Your mentioning of a fire pump brought with it other complications - fire pumps are not supposed to be supplied from the usual premises distribution but rather a separate service entrance that is not located with the usual premises distribution - the main reason is that you don't want the supply to the fire pump to get shut down accidentally if you are turning the rest of the premises off in an emergency situation.


The single pole breakers used for two pole applications - as mentioned is generally permitted, handle ties are required and not optional in this application. Is not too common to not use a double pole but certainly can be done, once you get higher then 20 maybe 30 amps availability of single pole breakers goes down and double pole is almost always used.

Also an approved handle tie may not always be easy to come by - that approval is sort of left to the AHJ. If they want you to use one made by the breaker manufacturer it often cost about same or even less to just use a double pole then to use two singles and the handle tie.
 

roger

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Fl
Occupation
Electrician
Wow... What part of my question is strange? I don't understand? Iam asking a simple question and expecting to get a simple answer from you all. I'd like to pose the question again. What is the purpose of using a double pole breaker the feed a motor ( any motor) where you can do the same thing by bringing two separate hot legs from two different single breaks? And if they both serve the same purpose why the handle tie CB's are permitted by the code? And just to let you know (for your own information) I got my license in 2009 , journeyman. If the question is a bit second class to you then you might blame that for my four year gap between the electrcal work and getting a college degree.
Your question is very elementary and as Infinity says, it was answered in post #7. The requirements of what you need to do as for what your are asking have been in the code for a many cycles.


Roger
 

Azad

Member
Location
Newyork city
Ok clear enough... Thanks.
Kwired is my brother . My question wasn't straight forward enough. I have a lot of questions and iam not afraid of asking them... So please don't be concerned. And let me ask my stupid questions even though I know the answers for most of them. We as electricians do things without knowing the true why's and how's... So please tolerate the class of the questions and let me in to your circle which I believe that it's an honor to be here. I need to know the why's and how's not what is the only rule or the only way to get the thing done. Thanks
Azzman.


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kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
Ok clear enough... Thanks.
Kwired is my brother . My question wasn't straight forward enough. I have a lot of questions and iam not afraid of asking them... So please don't be concerned. And let me ask my stupid questions even though I know the answers for most of them. We as electricians do things without knowing the true why's and how's... So please tolerate the class of the questions and let me in to your circle which I believe that it's an honor to be here. I need to know the why's and how's not what is the only rule or the only way to get the thing done. Thanks
Azzman.


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We are all different and all have different experiences and ways of understanding things. This site is here for people to use to learn, if they can't ask a question or give an answer - no matter how simple it may seem to others then what is the point of opening this site to those that come to learn? If it is only open to those that already know everything there is to know - what is the point period?

Those questions weren't necessarily aimed directly at you BTW.
 

Azad

Member
Location
Newyork city
Thanks Kwired... You're a brother to me from now on... You have a place here anytime you come to New York City.


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