four square box nailed to wood stud

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jonathanm850

New member
We have just taken over a job from another electrician and they had nailed four square boxes directly to the wood studs from the inside of the box through the small holes in the side with no bracket used. My question is if anyone knows if this is somehow a code violation? Would it have to be an approved method from the manufacturer?
 

mcclary's electrical

Senior Member
Location
VA
We have just taken over a job from another electrician and they had nailed four square boxes directly to the wood studs from the inside of the box through the small holes in the side with no bracket used. My question is if anyone knows if this is somehow a code violation? Would it have to be an approved method from the manufacturer?



IMO, that's what those holes are for
 

Buck Parrish

Senior Member
Location
NC & IN
314.23(b)1 seems to be refering to an old single gang work box with the nails through the back of the box.
However it does mention no screws in the back or ends of the enclosure. I guess what the OP has described would be the side of the box. Accordingly it would not be permited.
The hand book states (to prevent splitting of the framing wooden members)
I have used those holes thousands of times in metal studs. (b)1 does not address that.
 
314.23
(B) Structural Mounting.​
An enclosure supported from a
structural member of a building or from grade shall be
rigidly supported either directly or by using a metal, polymeric,
or wood brace.

(1) Nails and Screws.​
Nails and screws, where used as a
fastening means, shall be attached by using brackets on the
outside of the enclosure, or they shall pass through the interior
within 6 mm (
14 in.) of the back or ends of the enclosure.
Screws shall not be permitted to pass through the box unless
exposed threads in the box are protected using approved

means to avoid abrasion of conductor insulation.


The handbook is for guidance.

I posted the wording from the NEC. I am not sure how you surmised it discusses old work boxes or just wood framing.
 

don_resqcapt19

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Illinois
Occupation
retired electrician
Pierre,
I don't see the screws or nails as passing through the interior of the enclosure. They only pass through the side wall of the inclosure, and in my opinion, the installation is not a code violation.
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
Pierre,
I don't see the screws or nails as passing through the interior of the enclosure. They only pass through the side wall of the inclosure, and in my opinion, the installation is not a code violation.

I see it that way as well and have had this very argument with Ryan J. :)
 

macmikeman

Senior Member
Way I figure this is all the old timers on the cmp's who all did it that way with nails (and boy do I hate dealing with this on remodels) all must have died off. It worked fine for about 85 years until somebody invented a box with built in screws and suddenly the code changed...
 
Pierre,
I don't see the screws or nails as passing through the interior of the enclosure. They only pass through the side wall of the inclosure, and in my opinion, the installation is not a code violation.


I did not post it as a violation of the section I posted. I posted the section for informational purposes. I was curious as to how the other poster came to his conclusion.


I see using the side wall of the box with nails through the manufacturer's holes, or holes drilled through the side of the box as a potential issue with the listing of the box.

(I can't wait to see the response to this):D
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
I see using the side wall of the box with nails through the manufacturer's holes, or holes drilled through the side of the box as a potential issue with the listing of the box.

(I can't wait to see the response to this):D

Are you sure you cannot wait?:grin:


I think that is crazy talk, can you show me the labeling of the box?
 

jwelectric

Senior Member
Location
North Carolina
Would it be permissible to install a nail through the holes in the back of a 4 square box in order to mount one?

If so what would be the difference?

If not why?
 

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Journeyman Electrician
Passing through an old work box:

Gem%20box%20nails.jpg
 

Regularkevin

Member
Location
Auburn, WA
Ok, I have used all of those holes to mount 4sq boxes to everything. I have used nails, tech screws, toggles, ez anchors. I understand the code as saying that the screws cannot enter into the box. I was shown that the screws/ nails could damage the insulation on the wire.
 

jaylectricity

Senior Member
Location
Massachusetts
Occupation
licensed journeyman electrician
So many electrical products have so many holes and tabs that are frequently unused during my installations. I'm wondering the easiest way to find out from the manufacturer what particular use is assigned to each hole.
 
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