GFCI Shared neutral

[ActionDave]

I'm supposed to find a way to crimp the neutrals permanently.

Wouldn't be better to find someone that knows how to do electrical work and hire him as an electrician rather than paying electrician's wages to someone not qualified and sending him out on the next job where no one has permanently crimped all the neutrals together to blow more stuff up.

 

[electricalist]

Wouldn't be better to find someone that knows how to do electrical work and hire him as an electrician rather than paying electrician's wages to someone not qualified and sending him out on the next job where no one has permanently crimped all the neutrals together to blow more stuff up.

I'm a little confused by the comment.
The bldg was added on too and it's probable that where the home runs split was already there when they added on. Our company didn't do the work but 2 x I have been there for the same problem. The boxes are handy boxes with an extension ring in a block wall. First time I tap con a 4 sq blank after removing the plug. The 2 nd time it was in a different cell, the neutrals aren't very long not to mention I have to move inmates shut off all 3 circuits and do the repairs so I suggested I come back and crimp all the neutral in the 15 cells where the bldg was added on too , put TR plugs and put security screws on the device and plate.
If that's not a good plane then I guess they should get someone who knows what they're doing to fix it.

 

[ActionDave]

I'm a little confused by your response. I thought you said you were being sent out to permanently crimp together some neutrals that someone else had opened twice while replacing a GFCI recpt.

 

[electricalist]

The inmates in the cells are taking the plugs out opening the neutrals the put the HR neutral back on the gfci so it will 're set. Then when the guards are looking for the problem they don't see anything wrong because each cell the gfci is on. Not knowing till I showed them the neutrals branch off from each cell.

 

[ActionDave]

The inmates in the cells are taking the plugs out opening the neutrals the put the HR neutral back on the gfci so it will 're set. Then when the guards are looking for the problem they don't see anything wrong because each cell the gfci is on. Not knowing till I showed them the neutrals branch off from each cell.

Well that's a horse of a different colour.

Whose idea is it to put GFCI recpts in jail cells?.......
Give me your belt so you don't hang yourself, but we know your going to get bored so here is some somewhat inhibited access to live power. It's a puzzle you can work on while we all get some lunch.

 

[electricalist]

Well that's a horse of a different colour.

Whose idea is it to put GFCI recpts in jail cells?.......
Give me your belt so you don't hang yourself, but we know your going to get bored so here is some somewhat inhibited access to live power. It's a puzzle you can work on while we all get some lunch.

Its is an odity. In Texas the plugs are for heating up water(hot pot) and food ,small radio s with headphones , In reality is to heat up baby oil to throw on someone ,the radio is the lv power supply for your tattoo gun and the food is jack machrel that you keep in a sock in case you feel like asking the guy sitting on your bench not to sit there .

 

[black_thorn]

That can happen with any circuit, old or new, labeled or not.

It's still a safer act to have a neutral per circuit. Plus it allows you to only have to turn off a single circuit in the event you must work on one of them. Again, this is very handy in commercial and industrial environments where turning off circuits is a huge incovienence to the customer.

 

[electricalist]

We use single pole breakers and handle ties.
My supervisor insist on 1 hot 1 neutral .
If I can make it a non ccc. Then that's the better thing to do I'd think. I make my neutral up in a h box above the ceiling and put mwbc on the cover.

 

[kwired]

It's still a safer act to have a neutral per circuit. Plus it allows you to only have to turn off a single circuit in the event you must work on one of them. Again, this is very handy in commercial and industrial environments where turning off circuits is a huge incovienence to the customer.

And is totally a design decision to run separate neutrals not a requirement. Along with it comes more conduit fill, more current carrying conductors for conductor ampacity adjustments, more cost in copper used.

 

[electricalist]

Especially when 9 circuits turns into 6

 

[kwired]

Especially when 9 circuits turns into 6

Did you mean when 9 current carrying conductors turns into 6?

The real problem is when you have more then 10 CCC and now need to increase conductor sizes in many instances, if you can reduce to less then 10 you use less copper, and likely smaller raceway.

 

[ActionDave]

It's still a safer act to have a neutral per circuit. Plus it allows you to only have to turn off a single circuit in the event you must work on one of them. Again, this is very handy in commercial and industrial environments where turning off circuits is a huge incovienence to the customer.

And that is where 210(4)(b) has brought us. We are moving to a style of wiring that uses more copper, bigger pipe, less efficient circuits with more voltage drop, and less skilled electricians......all to avoid the boogey man of the open neutral.

It's not hard to safely work on a MWBC with the other two hots energized if you know what you are doing and it's not hard to know when you need to turn off the other two breakers.

 

[electricalist]

Did you mean when 9 current carrying conductors turns into 6?

The real problem is when you have more then 10 CCC and now need to increase conductor sizes in many instances, if you can reduce to less then 10 you use less copper, and likely smaller raceway.

Yes. That's what I meant.