77401
Banned
have you ever thought of leaving the wires stubbed out & using pop-in boxes after the baseboards are installed?
Height for general use receptacle
- Thread starter JAMAN
- Start date
- Status
bkludecke
Senior Member
- Location
- Big Bear Lake, CA
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
That's interesting. I've been doing this in CA for 34 years and have never heard of a minimum height (except for ADA requirements). We use floor receptacles when necessary to comply with spacing requirements so I guess the minimum height is "0" aff. I guess it could even be lower?marcb said:
al hildenbrand
Senior Member
- Location
- Minnesota
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor, Electrical Consultant, Electrical Engineer
Sure. I immediately thought of the single receptacle floor outlets that have the receptacle recessed below a nice threaded brass cover.bkludecke said:
So, its, what? a minus ?" AFF?
Jim W in Tampa
Senior Member
- Location
- Tampa Florida
drg said:
No,i never do that.I use a 4 foot flor. lamp.My x partner years ago would not only use his hammer but would make sure he missed it a few times to teach them.I must admit that after seeing this the gc would cut it out for him and we wasted no more time on this.Here lately we are seeing the number that are covered getting rather high.How many is too many.I have been known to charge to find them.
LarryFine
Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
- Location
- Henrico County, VA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
Let's call it 3/4" BFF. We don't want Rattus to have to explain whether we can use negative numbers.al hildenbrand said:
McDowellb
Banned
- Location
- Beverly Hills, CA
Well said Jim.....Jim W in Tampa said:
Jim W in Tampa
Senior Member
- Location
- Tampa Florida
marcb said:
Most do and i will not likely work on the others LOL.Now after they move in we might have a violation.
If you have a copy of the CEC (California Electrical Code) see section 210.50(E) The center of 15-, 20-, 30- amp receptacles outlets required by section 210.52(A),(B), and (C) shall be installed no less than 12" above the floor or working platform.bkludecke said:
McDowellb
Banned
- Location
- Beverly Hills, CA
Cheerio old chap!marcb said:
McDowellb
Banned
- Location
- Beverly Hills, CA
What about the receptacle for the dishwasher???marcb said:
LarryFine
Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
- Location
- Henrico County, VA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
Okay, I'll bite.McDowellb said:
What about it?
210.52 Dwelling Unit Receptacle Outlets. This section
provides requirements for 125-volt, 15- and 20-ampere receptacle
outlets. The receptacles required by this section
shall be in addition to any receptacle that is part of a luminaire
(lighting fixture) or appliance, or is controlled by a
wall switch in accordance with 210.70(A)(1) Exception No.
1, or is located within cabinets or cupboards, or is located
more than 1.7 m (51⁄2 ft) above the floor.
I do not believe that there is really a minimum height restriction other than ADA requirements. there is a maximum height retriction of 5 1/2 feet for those receptacles that will fulfill the requiremnets of 210.52. Keep in mind that outlets for specific loads may be placed at any height such as de iceing eq.etc. (gutter heaters)
Charlie
provides requirements for 125-volt, 15- and 20-ampere receptacle
outlets. The receptacles required by this section
shall be in addition to any receptacle that is part of a luminaire
(lighting fixture) or appliance, or is controlled by a
wall switch in accordance with 210.70(A)(1) Exception No.
1, or is located within cabinets or cupboards, or is located
more than 1.7 m (51⁄2 ft) above the floor.
I do not believe that there is really a minimum height restriction other than ADA requirements. there is a maximum height retriction of 5 1/2 feet for those receptacles that will fulfill the requiremnets of 210.52. Keep in mind that outlets for specific loads may be placed at any height such as de iceing eq.etc. (gutter heaters)
Charlie
Jim
Jim
Jim ,I did not really think you went around smashing in walls , but I understand the frustration .
Im usually not on jobs where we have to deal with drywall problems and the ones that I have been on buried boxes are far and few between .
We just locate them and cut the opening out, I don't think there is even a back charge for this because it may be only 1 or 2 and its usually not that hard to fix so emotions are not stired to any big degree and its looked at as a dumb mistake.
Other the hand I have heard stories about guys in residential that have a lot of their openings buried or the finisher plowing the boxes full or mud, sounds like nonsense is common is this part of the trade.
That sounds stupid and deliberate but still, if someone takes a hammer and starts beating holes in a wall they might want to reconsider that a customer is paying for this home or what ever structure your working on they would have every right to call the police and have you arrested for vandalism to their property !!!! You also may have someone flat out kick your ass if they catch you doing this .
Just think how you would react if you were spending a life savings to have something built and when you walk in you see some freaked out guy with a hammer is ruining your place ? Your going to be forced to react "but how" could get real ugly in the heat of the moment.
The best solution is just repair and include a back charge for the work it takes to get things in order , again I understand that a lot this is uncalled for and frustrating, but hitting the guys who do this in the pocket book will have a big impact too . Besides it will keep you out of trouble that you don't need or deserve in the first place.
Jim
Jim ,I did not really think you went around smashing in walls , but I understand the frustration .
Im usually not on jobs where we have to deal with drywall problems and the ones that I have been on buried boxes are far and few between .
We just locate them and cut the opening out, I don't think there is even a back charge for this because it may be only 1 or 2 and its usually not that hard to fix so emotions are not stired to any big degree and its looked at as a dumb mistake.
Other the hand I have heard stories about guys in residential that have a lot of their openings buried or the finisher plowing the boxes full or mud, sounds like nonsense is common is this part of the trade.
That sounds stupid and deliberate but still, if someone takes a hammer and starts beating holes in a wall they might want to reconsider that a customer is paying for this home or what ever structure your working on they would have every right to call the police and have you arrested for vandalism to their property !!!! You also may have someone flat out kick your ass if they catch you doing this .
Just think how you would react if you were spending a life savings to have something built and when you walk in you see some freaked out guy with a hammer is ruining your place ? Your going to be forced to react "but how" could get real ugly in the heat of the moment.
The best solution is just repair and include a back charge for the work it takes to get things in order , again I understand that a lot this is uncalled for and frustrating, but hitting the guys who do this in the pocket book will have a big impact too . Besides it will keep you out of trouble that you don't need or deserve in the first place.
McDowellb
Banned
- Location
- Beverly Hills, CA
What about the dishwasher receptacle mounting height? What height is the requirement for this outlet. The physically challenged cannot access this.LarryFine said:
sandsnow
Senior Member
- Location
- Southern California
marcb said:
I need to double check that 12" minimum rule you quoted. What I remember and what we enforce is this:
Commercial occupancies min. 15" AFF
Multi-Family res. requiring disabled access: 15" AFF
Single Family: No requirements
I will check this on Monday. btw it's not ADA in CA, it's Title 24. Not that I'm bragging, but our disabled access regs preceded the National ADA
from Larry LeVoir
Isn't ADA an acronym for Americans with Disabilities Act? Given the fact that it looks to me like americans are soon to be a minority in CA; it would only make sense to call it something else (Title 24).
BTW I have no idea how accurate the fact is. Just wanting to see what kind of response I might get.
Jim W in Tampa
Senior Member
- Location
- Tampa Florida
drg said:
The best way to teach them is to force them to come back out to cut them for you and then you charge for making a return trip to install the device.That gets them twice and only point 1 out at a time.A good (hard to find) super will mark the floors to avoid all of this.We just had an office building with 6 cans in ceiling and they cut only 4 out.Now tell me how they can be that stupid ,or is it blind ,perhaps they just dont care.While it is nothing for them it is a dirty nasty time consuming job for us.When we bid jobs we do not figure in time to do there job.I dont see this problem ever going away.Like most here 1 or 2 and i say nothing but when it reaches 10 or more i get more than a bit mad but the words i use are not in spanish so does no good.
allenwayne
Senior Member
77401 said:
That must have been the same custom builder I wired 100`s of homes for.They said that at that measurement all the HO had to do was keep hands at there sides and flip a switch.I would have loved to have been in the home after the fact and watched the 2 year olds running around flipping switches that they could reach with ease.LOL,LOL,LOL.
sandsnow
Senior Member
- Location
- Southern California
sandsnow said:
In the CA electrical code
210.50(E) only applies to enforcement by the local Health Official. Note the words [For DHS with exceptions] at the start of the section.
For items enforced by Local Building Official, see 406.3(G) Installation Heights, Items 1,2, and 3.
Minimum Height 15"
Max height 48"
See adoption matrix in the front of the Code.
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