Homeowner modified install between rough and final inspection

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Loffgren

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CA
Ok, i recently re-wired an entire knob and tube house with NM/B etc... I passed the rough in inspect. Upon my return to trim out i noticed that the home owner installed many more outlets, 3-way switches and the list goes on. Some how they also tied new exterior lighting into the bedroom arc-fault circuits. So itrimed out every thing i installed and told the customer i would not be able to work with any thing i installed that they "tapped" into. The project will not pass final, in my opinon. What the heck should i do to cover my self? Thanks
 
I had a similar situation and I sent a letter/spoke to the electrcal inspector and he made the homeowner pull a permit for whatever they did. Dunno if thats the best solution but at least its on file.
 
You should have addressed that BEFORE you started trimming.
You have no idea what they did behind the walls that will effect your installation.

What State are you in?
It may affect the responses.
 
Loffgren said:
Ok, i recently re-wired an entire knob and tube house with NM/B etc... I passed the rough in inspect. Upon my return to trim out i noticed that the home owner installed many more outlets, 3-way switches and the list goes on. Some how they also tied new exterior lighting into the bedroom arc-fault circuits. So itrimed out every thing i installed and told the customer i would not be able to work with any thing i installed that they "tapped" into. The project will not pass final, in my opinon. What the heck should i do to cover my self? Thanks
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I would not have trimed out anything. The easiest and best thing to do is get paid for the work you have done ( rough-in ) and pull you permit from the job with cause ( others working under your permit ) and tell the homeowner that it's all his.

That way he needs to get a new permit for the whole job and the inspector will not be nice when he knows the HO tried to hide things.
He may even get a real inspection.

Remember that it's the homeowner breaking the law and not you.:)
 
growler said:
I would not have trimed out anything. The easiest and best thing to do is get paid for the work you have done ( rough-in ) and pull you permit from the job with cause ( others working under your permit ) and tell the homeowner that it's all his.:)
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My thoughts exactly.
 
Loffgren said:
So itrimed out every thing
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This is the problem. You may not get paid. If you walked before you trimmed you would have been better off. I am sorry that the HO put you in a bad situation. It stinks.
 
I had a job where the contractor had me go to the job give him an estimate on the work then a month later called and said he was ready. The carpenter had cut out a support wall, taped up wires for the old lighting circuit and a few other things, and jammed them up in the ceiling covering them with insullation to hide them. He was supposed to only put vinyl sidding on the outside and drywall up inside after I was done.
I went to my truck got out the agreement I had written up, wrote a hold harmless on the back "I hold harmless for damages incurred and release said contractor for .... etc.." had the owner sign it and left. Never got paid never worked for them again, out of sight out of mind.
I dont like it when the division of work is violated. It's an insult but sometimes construction isnt nice. If you cant trust the owner or contractor not to keep the lines of demarkation of work seperate then put it in writting. Mike Holt has a kick butt contract with an exclusivity clause that stops this kinda thing cold.
What you experienced was misscommunication or maybe a wilful violation of your contract. I think its called contractual interference. No lawyer would touch it. But the inspector should be aware that your permit was worked on by others without your permission. Maybe the insulation should be removed so that the ruffin could be properly inspected and oh yea, the drywall too? Street justice ... yea!
 
RE

RE

I work in CA. I did get paid for the job, all but four hundred. I will let the inspector know. Luckily i took digital pics of my work before. Thanks for the advice
 
Loffgren said:
I work in CA. I did get paid for the job, all but four hundred. I will let the inspector know. Luckily i took digital pics of my work before. Thanks for the advice
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If you can take the $400.00 hit put in WRIGHTING what has occurred to the inspector with copy's of photo's. Then in WRIGHTING send a letter to the HO stating that due to his actions of additional wiring with out your approval or direction he has voided all warranty on material and workmanship.
I am doing a church we rough in a recp in ceiling for projector per their location. I go back a few weeks later to trim out cans, recp. has been moved, they found out their location was wrong, they added a box and ran 15' of SJ cord from original box to new box in the ceiling. When I saw this I went off on the GC. They had three choices pay me $500.00 to correct. Have the preachers son, who is a lic. elect., crawl in cavity above ceiling replace their plastic box with metal and run 15' of mc. Or I would just call inspector show him what had been done, void the warranty and they could find some else to take over the permit.
Now on a personal rant, because of a Monday from hell, Why is it people will not mess with the plumbing or HVAC but will come in and screw with the wiring like the electrical system of a building is a toy. Oh I think I'll add this switch I'll get me some of that 600 volt wire from the blue or orange store and just run it where I need it. Pisses me off
 
ceb said:
They had three choices pay me $500.00 to correct. Have the preachers son, who is a lic. elect., crawl in cavity above ceiling replace their plastic box with metal and run 15' of mc. Or I would just call inspector show him what had been done, void the warranty and they could find some else to take over the permit.
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What did they choose? :-?
 
I live in a state where it is illegal to do any wiring unless you are a licensed electrician, employed and under the supervision of a licensed electrical contractor, or are yourself a licensed electrical contractor. While this has absolutely no bearing on unlicensed hacks because of lack of enforcement, the very situation you describe is a foolproof reason to get the regulated industry people out to the job to do some enforcement. Where I live you are also allowed to drag a city inspector into the mess, and given that the customer is breaking the law, and doing unauthorized electrical work under your permit, city citations get written. Hopefully in your area there are equal protections that you can bring into play.
 
I recently had one like this - he didn't add anything - but started trim on his own for some reason.... Opened it all for a look-see and corrected a few things.... No biggy...

A few years ago I had a GC who didn't like the price of the changes - so he did it himself after I was gone, and expected me to trim it out - no dice - I only trimmed what was un-molested, and would not trim any cicrcuit he touched of which were wholely obvious - one recognizes their own work.... Not quite sure what happened to the rest of that job, I refused to go back.... Or ever work for the guy again. My employer at the time worked something out, but I didn't care to know what....:mad:
 
In this jurisdiction, once you submit for a rough-wire inspection (we do not issue permits) you are the electrician of record for the job. If someone else does electrical work on your job, you should report that person to the inspector and the permits department. Otherwise it is assumed that the work was done by the electrician of record and they will be held responsible for it. If the homeowner or GC wants to get someone else to do electrical work on your job, you must sign a release that allows them to do so and releases you from responsibility.
In this case the homeowner has committed a serious violation.
 
Loffgren said:
Ok, i recently re-wired an entire knob and tube house with NM/B etc... I passed the rough in inspect. Upon my return to trim out i noticed that the home owner installed many more outlets, 3-way switches and the list goes on. Some how they also tied new exterior lighting into the bedroom arc-fault circuits. So itrimed out every thing i installed and told the customer i would not be able to work with any thing i installed that they "tapped" into. The project will not pass final, in my opinon. What the heck should i do to cover my self? Thanks
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Contracts can be breeched by holders. In this example, it seems to me, the contract is being breeched by inaction on the part of the parties involved(ultimately the homeowner) to protect the contract from unwarranted interference by others who are outside the terms of the contract. :smile: Contract is void. Write a new one.
 
ceb said:
If you can take the $400.00 hit put in WRIGHTING what has occurred to the inspector with copy's of photo's. Then in WRIGHTING send a letter to the HO stating that due to his actions of additional wiring with out your approval or direction he has voided all warranty on material and workmanship.
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Wrighting?
 
lpelectric said:
Contract is void. Write a new one.
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...and what if the HO/GC decides NOT to sign your new agreement....or pay any outstanding balance from the voided contract?
(This is "in general" and not directly tied to the OP's situation)
 
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